Expert: Joseph Lee O. - 7/5/2008

Question
QUESTION: Mr. Lee, I wrote you back in December about my husband who had gone
through terrible DT's and was in a nursing home=he refused to see anyone
for help such as AA, and wouldn't talk about it.  I did divorce him.  His grown
son and daughter would not help with anything (understandably).  Their
history with him as a father was not very good.  However, since they couldn't
step in, I still took care of him (while going thru a divorce which went very
fast).  After that he agreed to go to AA, he has his own apt. and I see him
almost every day and I know for a fact he has not had a drop of alcohol since
this terrible episode in Dec.!  I am feeling terrible about the divorce, and
would like to restore our marriage.  However, my family really dislikes him-he
was terrible to everyone when we were married.  I'm afraid of being a cast out
again if they know I am still seeing and taking care of him.  But he truly has
no one.  And he goes to AA faithfully.  I see a whole different person=like the
one I first met.  I am thinking if he can stay this way at least another 6
months it is a very good sign, don't you?  I still am working my 2 jobs, so he
would still be home alone if he moved back home, and I wonder if he knows
everything is back to normal if he would be tempted to drink again.  Any
thoughts=any stats on this?  Thank you, Pat

ANSWER: Greetings again, Pat.

Your update is certainly encouraging ... yet please go slowly and cautiously.  For your husband's sake as well as your own, each of you needs to be certain of some actual recovery well beyond merely not drinking.  Here are some thoughts along that line from from "Alcoholics Anonymous", the book:

“Sometimes we hear an alcoholic say that the only thing he needs to do is to keep sober.  Certainly he must keep sober, for there will be no home if he doesn't.  But he is yet a long way from making good to the wife or parents whom for years he has so shockingly treated.  Passing all understanding is the patience mothers and wives have had with alcoholics.  Had this not been so, many of us would have no homes today, would perhaps be dead.
“The alcoholic is like a tornado roaring his way through the lives of others.  Hearts are broken.  Sweet relationships are dead.  Affections have been uprooted.  Selfish and inconsiderate habits have kept the home in turmoil.  We feel a man is unthinking when he says that sobriety is enough.  He is like the farmer who came up out of his cyclone cellar to find his home ruined.  To his wife, he remarked, ‘Don't see anything the matter here, Ma.  Ain't it grand the wind stopped blowin’?’
“Yes, there is a long period of reconstruction ahead.  We must take the lead.  A remorseful mumbling that we are sorry won't fill the bill at all.  We ought to sit down with the family and frankly analyze the past as we now see it, being very careful not to criticize them.  Their defects may be glaring, but the chances are that our own actions are partly responsible.  So we clean house with the family, asking each morning in meditation that our Creator show us the way of patience, tolerance, kindliness and love.” (pages 82-83)

"If there be divorce or separation, there should be no undue haste for the couple to get together.  The man should be sure of his recovery.  The wife should fully understand his new way of life.  If their old relationship is to be resumed it must be on a better basis, since the former did not work.  This means a new attitude and spirit all around.  Sometimes it is to the best interests of all concerned that a couple remain apart.  Obviously, no rule can be laid down.  Let the alcoholic continue his program day by day.  When the time for living together has come, it will be apparent to both parties.
"Let no alcoholic say he cannot recover unless he has his family back.  This just isn't so.  In some cases the wife will never come back for one reason or another.  Remind the prospect that his recovery is not dependent upon people.  It is dependent upon his relationship with G-d.  We have seen men get well whose families have not returned at all.  We have seen others slip when the family came back [together] too soon." (pages 99-100)

You have written:

>> I see a whole different person=like the one I first met.

I understand, but you still need to look very closely.  The person you first met turned out to be a very sick man, and now you are watching for someone who has been transformed into a man much more like what you had first thought he was.

>> I am thinking if he can stay this way at least another 6 months it is a very good sign, don't you?

Yes, possibly.  But again, you are watching for a true change far beyond mere abstinence.

>> I still am working my 2 jobs, so he would still be home alone if he moved back home, and I wonder if he knows everything is back to normal if he would be tempted to drink again.  Any thoughts=any stats on this?

Spending all day “home alone” is not good for anyone, and he should not even want to come back to the house unless he has something to actually contribute.  If he has a decent “sponsor” helping him with the Twelve Steps, a time should come when he will come to you as mentioned above:

“Yes, there is a long period of reconstruction ahead.  We [alcoholics] must take the lead.  A remorseful mumbling that we are sorry won't fill the bill at all.  We ought to sit down with the family and frankly analyze the past as we now see it ... [and making amends wherever we can].”

>> he agreed to go to AA, he has his own apt. ...

He needs to remain right there doing that until he actually *wants* to be doing that.

>> I know for a fact he has not had a drop of alcohol ...

Ask him how he is coming along with the Twelve Steps and let me know how he responds.

>> I am feeling terrible about the divorce, and would like to restore our marriage.

Why do you feel terrible about the divorce?  Also, it is his responsibility to “restore your marriage”, not yours.  Over time, give him an opportunity to prove himself as a real man.

>> my family really dislikes him-he was terrible to everyone when we were married.

Before the two of you might ever get back together, he should make an honest effort to do this same kind of thing with them:

“Yes, there is a long period of reconstruction ahead.  We [alcoholics] must take the lead.  A remorseful mumbling that we are sorry won't fill the bill at all.  We ought to sit down with the family and frankly analyze the past as we now see it ... [seeking forgiveness and making amends wherever we can].”

>> I'm afraid of being a cast out again if they know I am still seeing and taking care of him.  But he truly has no one.  And he goes to AA faithfully.

Hoping he has made contact with some people who actually know how to help him recover, let his recovery friends become his “family” for a year or two.  You cannot change how your family thinks or feels about your husband, but you can keep from putting yourself back into the insane situation of your past.

Many years ago, I heard the story of a man who had ended up on skid row for a time.  Now possibly about 50 years ago, his wife had done exactly what you have done, including making sure he knew where he should be able to get help.  After he had been sober for nearly two years, she let his sponsor know she could use some help paying the bills and raising their children and so on, and his sponsor helped the two of them begin coming back together.  Most important in this story is that the man had returned to the house for the sole purpose of being helpful, and your life will again become just as it was and even worse unless your own husband truly takes the Twelve Steps and learns to do exactly the same.  Tell your husband you would like to meet some of the people who are helping him.  You need someone close by helping you to know when the time might actually be right.

Be encouraged, Pat, be patient, and please continue keeping me updated ...

Joseph Lee O.


---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Well, Mr. Lee, my husband is still sober. He does go to A.A., but says he doesn't need a sponsor. Also, he says they don't spend a lot of time on the 12 steps, they just talk.  He has seen some of my family.  My brother flat out told him just yesterday "I have to compliment you--YOu're like a different person.  I didn't like you before, but I really like you now".  Which was nice.  But my one son that I really am concerned about doesn't know I'm seeing Pat (husband).  He really did not like him.

He had a 6 month lease on his apt. and his hinting at he won't be needing it (like he will be moving back home).  I am not ready for that.  Also, I have asked him to call his son and/or daughter to let them know he is ok, but he still hasn't done so.  

I guess I felt bad about the divorce because I truly never thought he would ever quit drinking-that as soon as he left the nursing home he would be drinking, but he hasn't.
However, since I own my own home and I am the one with any assets at all; he has virtually nothing but his personal possessions, I am not especially eager to jump into marriage again and risk losing everything if he starts drinking again.  I was told when he was in the hospital and the nursing home that he would never quit, etc., etc. and that I would be responsible for him forever.  I have not talked to his son and daughter since he was in the hospital a few months ago for hip surgery.  I had him call his daughter to let her know he was having surgery. She was very nice but has never called to see how things are.  

I guess I wonder if he will stay sober.  He will be 68 next week.  I work at a church, and he has been faithful about attending the church we were married in (my church) as well as the church I work at.  I still have not had the nerve to tell anyone outside family and one friend. (shame? embarrassment at having been so foolish at my age and makinga  poor choice?  Will they be disappointed in me and think I should've stuck it out?, etc. etc.)

Well, if there are any statistics to help me figure this out, that would be great!  Thank you! Pat

Answer
Greetings again, Pat.

It is impossible to know precisely what will happen in the days ahead, but there is at least one indicator I believe you should not consider doing without:

“... there is a long period of reconstruction ahead.  [The alcoholic] must take the lead.  A remorseful mumbling that [he is] sorry won't fill the bill at all.  [He] ought to sit down with the family and frankly analyze the past as [he] now [sees] it, being very careful not to criticize them.  Their defects may be glaring, but the chances are that [his] own actions are partly responsible.  So [he is to] clean house with the family, asking each morning in meditation that our Creator show [him] the way of patience, tolerance, kindliness and love.
“The spiritual life is not a theory.  [He has] have to live it.” (“Alcoholics Anonymous”, the book, page 83)

In other words: He needs to be approaching you, his own children and yours and everyone else in both families in a way much different than he has ever before done.  At the moment, he has displayed and is now displaying nothing more than this:

“The alcoholic is like a tornado roaring his way through the lives of others.  Hearts are broken.  Sweet relationships are dead.  Affections have been uprooted.  Selfish and inconsiderate habits have kept the home in turmoil.  We feel a man is unthinking when he says that sobriety is enough.  He is like the farmer who came up out of his cyclone cellar to find his home ruined.  To his wife, he remarked, ‘Don't see anything the matter here, Ma.  Ain't it grand the wind stopped blowin'?’” (page 82)

You have written:

>> He does go to A.A., but says he doesn't need a sponsor.

Nonsense.

>> Also, he says they don't spend a lot of time on the 12 steps, they just talk.

Permanent recovery is only found after taking the Steps.

>> He had a 6 month lease on his apt. and his hinting at he won't be needing it (like he will be moving back home).  I am not ready for that.

Make it clear to him that he will not be coming back into your home until after he has remained completely sober for at least another year.

>> I guess I felt bad about the divorce because I truly never thought he would ever quit drinking ...

The pressure he felt might have motivated him a bit, but that motivation will likely be short-lived when he finds out he cannot get whatever he wants whenever he wants it.

Keep this in mind:

“If there be divorce or separation, there should be no undue haste for the couple to get together.  The man should be sure of his recovery.  The wife should fully understand his new way of life.  If their old relationship is to be resumed it must be on a better basis, since the former did not work.  This means a new attitude and spirit all around.  Sometimes it is to the best interests of all concerned that a couple remain apart.  Obviously, no rule can be laid down.  Let the alcoholic continue his program day by day.  When the time for living together has come, it will be apparent to both parties.” (page 99)

>> I guess I wonder if he will stay sober.

Only if he humbles himself and submits to spiritual transformation.

>> I still have not had the nerve to tell anyone outside family and one friend.

Tell everyone he is sober and still showing an interest in you, and let him know he needs to go out of his way to make amends and leave right impressions among the people whose opinions you hold in high regard.

>> Well, if there are any statistics to help me figure this out, that would be great!

Here is one I have never found to be wrong:

“Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed [the original A.A.] path.  Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program, usually men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves.  There are such unfortunates.  They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way.  They are naturally incapable of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty.” (page 58)

Share your concerns openly with your children and friends and maintain a safe distance from your ex-husband until everyone is at least reasonably comfortable with whatever you ultimately decide ... and please do stay in touch here.

Joseph Lee