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Antique Safes/J&J SAFE

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Question
HI ANDY
TRYING TO OPEN A J&J SAFE AND NOT SURE WHAT YOU MEAN ON THE LAST RIGHT TURN TO UNTIL IT CLICKS.ASLO AS WELL WHERE IS STARTING POINT ON THE DIAL AND I HAVE A 12OCLOCK AND A TWO OCLOCK.ANYH HELP WOULD BE GREAT AS i NEED TO GET THSI OPEN.
STEPHEN

Answer
Stephen,

there is no starting point!!!    Reminds me of the joke about telling the blonde to stand in the corner of a round room!   LOL!

Simply START dialing - if the lock is 5 x R to the first number, it does not matter where you start - AND more importantly you are NOT counting the revolutions of the dial, you are counting the individual number as IT arrives at the 12 o'clock mark.

So if your first number is 50, you would begin turning the dial clockwise (RIGHT), stopping the fifth time the number 50 ARRIVES at the 12 o'clock index mark.

The "2 o'clock mark" is a service index - ignore it.


The last turn of the dial is for the drive wheel or cam.   As it turns, it will engage the lever assembly and retract the locking bolt of the lock.    If the combination is NOT dialed correctly, or you don't have the correct combination, the lever will not engage the drive wheel, and will not retract the lever.
When the lever has been fully retracted, the lever and cam interaction WILL stop the movement of the dial - so the last turn (on a four wheel lock) would be  1 x R until the dial stops.

Dialing sequences ARE determined by the type of lock, the number of wheels and whether the lock is a left handed or right handed lock - so in general 4 wheel locks would dial either RLRLR or LRLRL, and 3 wheel locks would dial either LRLR or RLRL.

Hope this helps to explain the operation.  

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Terry V. Andreasen (Andy)

Expertise

Safe and Vault related Questions; Antique Safe Repair and Restoration; With over 44 years in the Safe & Vault industry, if I can't answer your question I know where to get the answer. Current Project: Restoration of an Ely Norris Cannonball Safe from the early 1900's. Will answer Safe & Vault related questions concerning age, value, restoration, moving, opening & repairing, parts, operation and history. Note: It is not my intention to teach you to open safes or to provide information which may aid in the unlawful opening of a safe. I will not give out drill points or information which I deem inappropriate.

Experience

44 years in the Safe & Vault Industry. Owner and Service Manager for one of the largest Safe & Vault companies on the West Coast. Graduate of Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing, Safe lock Manipulation and Safe Deposit Lock Courses. Graduate of Locksmith Institute. Author of "The Coffee Table Guide to Antique Safes". Certified Instructor for the California Locksmith Association teaching Basic and Advanced Lock Servicing, Basic Safe opening and Repairing. Factory Trained by AMSEC, LORD Safes, LeFebure, Mosler, KabaMas, LaGard and Sargent & Greenleaf

Organizations
Safecrackers International and the National Antique Safe Association Safe & Vault Technicians Association

Publications
The Coffee Table Guide to Antique Safes AllExperts.com

Education/Credentials
Graduate of Locksmith Institute 1972 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing 1974 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Manipulation 1975 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Deposit Lock Servicing 1985 Instructor Certified - California Locksmith Association - 1985 Factory trained by AMSEC, MAJOR, STAR, Johnson-Pacific, Kaba-MAS, Allied-Gary, ISM, Lord, Brown Safe, EXL, Mosler, Diebold.

Awards and Honors
2009 - 2015 Listed in AllExperts top 50 Experts. All Experts Categories - Safes & Security Containers, Locksmithing, Antique Safes. Retired US Army Chief Warrant Officer (CW4), with 39 years of total service. With numerous awards from Vietnam, Desert Storm and Operation Iraqi Freedom. US Navy - 1971-1981 US Army Reserve 1984-2013 US Army Retired

Past/Present Clients
US Secret Service, FBI, BATF, Local Law enforcment agencies, Diebold, Hamilton Pacific, Red Hawk Int., Chubb International, Bank of America, Wells Fargo Bank, Mechanics Bank, El Dorado Savings Bank, many Credit unions and smaller banks. McDonalds, Togos, BurgerKing, TacoBell, Carls Jr. FoodMaxx, SaveMart, Lucky's, Albertson's, Raley's, Safeway, NobHill, Bell Markets, PW Markets. Great America, Century Theatres, Cinemark Theatres, UA Cinemas, and many homeowners and small businesses. Provide warranty service for lock and safe manufactures. Service area is Northern California - Fresno to Oregon, including western Nevada

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