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QUESTION: Hi, I hope you can help, our father left a safe, it's open and we have the combination. The problem is we do not know the manufacturer, the only markings is the tag inside the door. Just in case you can't make out the serial number from the picture, it is 4Y80591.

         Thanks Joe


The safe looks like a fire resistive cell phone!!!!   

The "specification"  F2-ND on the SMNA label indicates that this is considered a Fire Resistive Filing Cabinet and NOT a safe.

Regardless of if it has a combination lock installed, it is still not considered a safe.

As for the manufacturer I would have to see the container.     The SMNA label is similar to having a UL (underwriters Labs) inspection label.   It has nothing to do with the safe or the manufacturer other than indicating the "standard" the container was built to comply with.

If you have other photos I would be happy to look at them.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Thanks Terry, I've attached another photo, as well as the dimensions. The box is 16" long, 17.5" side and 10" high. Not sure if you can make it out from the pic, but there does appear to be an "N" inscribided on the dial. Even though it's not a safe, we would still be interested about the manufacturer and when it was made. Again Thanks


Hi Joe,

The photo really doesn't give me much to look at - and (not your fault) this site isn't really photo friendly.   Please send photos of the container directly to my email at:

I'll need full size photos of the front, sides, interior, any tags, locks, dials handles, etc.    I need to be able to see the container as if I was in front of it with a magnifying glass.   If there is something interesting on the container that you want me to look at I'll need a photo of it as well.

The serial number that you mentioned earlier is the serial number for the tag and not the container.   As SMNA hasn't been around since the early 1960's there are also no records available to see what this tag was assigned to.

Send the photos to me and I'll see what I can come up with for you.

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Terry V. Andreasen (Andy)


Safe and Vault related Questions; Antique Safe Repair and Restoration; With over 44 years in the Safe & Vault industry, if I can't answer your question I know where to get the answer. Current Project: Restoration of an Ely Norris Cannonball Safe from the early 1900's. Will answer Safe & Vault related questions concerning age, value, restoration, moving, opening & repairing, parts, operation and history. Note: It is not my intention to teach you to open safes or to provide information which may aid in the unlawful opening of a safe. I will not give out drill points or information which I deem inappropriate.


44 years in the Safe & Vault Industry. Owner and Service Manager for one of the largest Safe & Vault companies on the West Coast. Graduate of Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing, Safe lock Manipulation and Safe Deposit Lock Courses. Graduate of Locksmith Institute. Author of "The Coffee Table Guide to Antique Safes". Certified Instructor for the California Locksmith Association teaching Basic and Advanced Lock Servicing, Basic Safe opening and Repairing. Factory Trained by AMSEC, LORD Safes, LeFebure, Mosler, KabaMas, LaGard and Sargent & Greenleaf

Safecrackers International and the National Antique Safe Association Safe & Vault Technicians Association

The Coffee Table Guide to Antique Safes

Graduate of Locksmith Institute 1972 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing 1974 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Manipulation 1975 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Deposit Lock Servicing 1985 Instructor Certified - California Locksmith Association - 1985 Factory trained by AMSEC, MAJOR, STAR, Johnson-Pacific, Kaba-MAS, Allied-Gary, ISM, Lord, Brown Safe, EXL, Mosler, Diebold.

Awards and Honors
2009 - 2015 Listed in AllExperts top 50 Experts. All Experts Categories - Safes & Security Containers, Locksmithing, Antique Safes. Retired US Army Chief Warrant Officer (CW4), with 39 years of total service. With numerous awards from Vietnam, Desert Storm and Operation Iraqi Freedom. US Navy - 1971-1981 US Army Reserve 1984-2013 US Army Retired

Past/Present Clients
US Secret Service, FBI, BATF, Local Law enforcment agencies, Diebold, Hamilton Pacific, Red Hawk Int., Chubb International, Bank of America, Wells Fargo Bank, Mechanics Bank, El Dorado Savings Bank, many Credit unions and smaller banks. McDonalds, Togos, BurgerKing, TacoBell, Carls Jr. FoodMaxx, SaveMart, Lucky's, Albertson's, Raley's, Safeway, NobHill, Bell Markets, PW Markets. Great America, Century Theatres, Cinemark Theatres, UA Cinemas, and many homeowners and small businesses. Provide warranty service for lock and safe manufactures. Service area is Northern California - Fresno to Oregon, including western Nevada

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