Expert: Brian Thompson - 8/9/2011

Question
Before I ask my question let me explain a little about myself, I attend an Assembly of God Church here in London, and until a couple of months ago was sure my faith was true, however I started studying with a couple of local Jehovah's witnesses and since then they have shown me things and scriptures that I didn't even know existed.

At first I use to argue endlessly with them but with no effect as they always had a scripture at hand to prove what they were saying, at one point I even arranged my minister to sit in so that he argue our belief's but once I told him it was with Witnesses he didn't turn up.

Anyway recently during our study they talked about Jesus and how he's simply the Son of God and not part of the Godhead, and that only Jehovah is the Almighty God and created Jesus. Now I've been taught and thought everybody was taught that That the Father-Son-And Holy Ghost make up the God and argued this point showing them the relevant scriptures. BUT yet again they had there own scriptural proof that Jesus was created, they showed me the following scriptures;

(Colossians 1:14-15) "..By means of whom we have our release by ransom, the forgiveness of our sins.  He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, THE FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION.."

(Revelation 3:14) “..And to the angel of the congregation in La‧o‧di‧ce′a write: These are the things that the Amen [Jesus] says, the faithful and true witness, THE BEGINNING OF CREATION BY GOD.."

(Proverbs 8:22-23) “..JEHOVAH HIMSELF PRODUCED ME [Jesus] as the beginning of his way, the earliest of his achievements of long ago. From time indefinite I was installed, from the start, from times earlier than the earth.."

Please could you help me and explain that if Jesus was created as these scriptures say, then how can he be God, since God created all things as Hebrews 3:4 says, thank you so much.

Answer
Hi Ray let me address this first with a statement. Jehovah's Witnesses are well intentioned but their ultimate goal is to cause confusion. They are able to do this because they are much better prepared than their target. I agree with the approach of your Pastor. Nothing is served by debating with Jehovah's Witnesses. When they come to me I refuse their magazine and always say that Jesus will lead me in truth. I never invite them to put their views because I know that they have a preprepared agenda and a barrel of their Scriptures

"I started studying with a couple of local Jehovah's witnesses and since then they have shown me things and scriptures that I didn't even know existed." There in lies your problem you did not study for yourself and were ill prepared. I suggest you get the BIBLE on CD and listen to it in its entirity as well as reading the Scripture

Let me take your Scriptures and discuss them and I am not doing this so you can debate JW.


(Colossians 1:14-15) "..By means of whom we have our release by ransom, the forgiveness of our sins.  He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, THE FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION.."

15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.

When we look at this we see creation has a broader meaning than just the creation of man. Jesus is flesh as we are and in that he is the first born of those to be ressurrected, but he preexisted everything and is the lamb slain before the beginning of the Earth. He is the living word

You see that much damage is done to the meaning when only a small partion of Scripture is taken and JW have their own version of the Bible in which words have been substituted

(Revelation 3:14) “..And to the angel of the congregation in La‧o‧di‧ce′a write: These are the things that the Amen [Jesus] says, the faithful and true witness, THE BEGINNING OF CREATION BY GOD.."

14 “To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
  These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God’s creation.

You see here the wording has been altered to agree with their interpretation

(Proverbs 8:22-23) “..JEHOVAH HIMSELF PRODUCED ME [Jesus] as the beginning of his way, the earliest of his achievements of long ago. From time indefinite I was installed, from the start, from times earlier than the earth.."

“I, wisdom, dwell together with prudence;
  I possess knowledge and discretion.
13 To fear the LORD is to hate evil;
  I hate pride and arrogance,
  evil behavior and perverse speech.
14 Counsel and sound judgment are mine;
  I have insight, I have power.
15 By me kings reign
  and rulers issue decrees that are just;
16 by me princes govern,
  and nobles—all who rule on earth.[b]
17 I love those who love me,
  and those who seek me find me.
18 With me are riches and honor,
  enduring wealth and prosperity.
19 My fruit is better than fine gold;
  what I yield surpasses choice silver.
20 I walk in the way of righteousness,
  along the paths of justice,
21 bestowing a rich inheritance on those who love me
  and making their treasuries full.

22 “The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works,[c][d]
  before his deeds of old;

Here they have taken the word out of context. The Scripture speaks about wisdom (v 12) not Jesus

As far as the Trinity is concerned I simply answer that the Scripture makes it plain in other places that Jesus is God. he is not a lesser God but equal to God, Yehweh because he is Yehweh

The most telling is in the words I am your salvation. God, Yehweh, says this in the Old Testament and Jesus uses the exact same words in the New Testament. If Jesus is a created being  as JW insist, then for him to say this is blasphemy because he makes himself equal with God before he is glorified. Jesus also says the Father and I are one. You have seen me you have seen the father. He cannot say that unless he is equal to the Father, unless he is the Father. So Jesus is either who he says he is or he is a liar or a lunatic. Which do they say he is? If he is a created being he had no need to be born, he could simply have appeared.


So I say to you don't spend your time debating JW instead study the Word and seek God for the baptism of the Holy Spirit because the Holy Spirit will lead you into all truth