Expert: Austin Cline - 9/10/2002

Question
An Atheist on this site explained to me that it is impossible to prove explicitly, that something (a Deity) does not exist. Since Atheists will not except all that does exist, as evidence of a Creator,
aren't Atheist and Theist alike, just working from faith?  It seems that the A/Theist starts with their own agenda and build an argument for their side, using exactly the same evidences.

i.e. The Big Bang Theory. This theory states that we can trace the movement of the Universe backwards to a time in which all that now exists came from a point and place, in time and space, that was so small that it would have been invisible.

Both sides use this same evidence to prove their point.  Aren't both sides simply working from Faith?  One, having faith  in what is? The other, having faith in what is not? How is one any different than the other? Both seem to be mirror images of each other.  

Answer
You ask some complicated questions - complicated, because they rest upon some misunderstandings about atheism. Fortunately, I've already addresses these points in a FAQ posted elsewhere. I will try to provide short answers along with links to the more detailed FAQs. If you would like to explore any of the issues in more depth, feel free to ask further questions. Hopefully, though, the FAQs will provide the information you need...

"An Atheist on this site explained to me that it is impossible to prove explicitly, that something (a Deity) does not exist."

That atheist was mistaken. Some claims cannot be disproven, but some can - what is required is that the claim contain specific information rather than just be vague. With that, even claims about gods can be disproven:

http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/blfaq_ath_myth_disproof.htm

"Since Atheists will not except all that does exist, as evidence of a Creator, aren't Atheist and Theist alike, just working from faith?"

First, you may be working from a misunderstanding of what atheism is. Atheists do not necessarily declare "God does not exist." Most atheists simply do not accept the claims that some god exists. That does not require proof and it doesn't require faith:

http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/blfaq_atheismdef.htm

Second, the term "faith" can be used in more than one way. When atheists rely upon "faith" for something, they are not using the word in its religious sense (belief in the absence of evidence). They are, rather, using it in its more general sense of believing even with absolute proof:

http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQs/blfaq_ath_myth_faith.htm

"It seems that the A/Theist starts with their own agenda and build an argument for their side, using exactly the same evidences."

It is true that some atheists and some theists are trying to reach a pre-determined goal and are using whatever they can find to get there. However, it shouldn't be assumed that that is true is every instance. Most of the atheists I know used to be Christians - because they used to be believers, it is unreasonable to argue that they ended up supporting atheism simply because they wanted atheism to be proven. Quite the contrary, they wanted and expected Christianity to be true but, after closer examination, failed to find support for that.

"Both sides use this same evidence to prove their point. Aren't both sides simply working from Faith?"

Not necessarily. If you use evidence to support an idea, and that evidence *really does* support the idea logically, then you aren't working from faith. You are, instead, working from evidence and logic.

So, if two sides are using the same evidence to make the same point, and the two "points" are mutually exclusive, then either the evidence is ambiguous or at least one side is making a mistake.

If the evidence is ambiguous, then both sides need to admit that they aren't creating a conclusive proof.

If the evidence isn't so ambiguous, then someone is making a mistake - that someone is, as you describe, working from an agenda to reach a pre-determined conclusion.

Feel free to write back if you have further questions about any of the above...