Expert: Dr. Dennis W. Neder - 10/15/2009

Question
QUESTION: Doc, I have a couple scenarios to run by you. The first was a test, I believe. I was dating this very cute, 8 out of 10, lady for about 2 months. She actually fit quite a few of the characteristics on my wish list...sigh... Here's the major conflict in our brief story together. I have a huge commitment to a show. Early in the relationship I let her know that I had cowritten and was coproducing and starring in a musical show. The time demands of this have been huge. Of course, she practically raped me on the spot...or a very nearby spot after learning this. But how things change with time.

About 1 month into the relationship she said she has fatigue issues if she stays up late because she works and gets up early and asked for a little bit more personal time. Sounded pretty reasonable to me. We went from seeing each other 5 to 6 nights a weeks to about 3-4 nights a week. I thought this was good. I like a little down time.

About 3 weeks ago, or 1.5 months into the relationship, she said she was feeling depressed and tired and this was normal for her and she has been taking mild antidepressants for some time to help her cope (woah oh, red flag for me). She actually then proceeded to unload a lot of crap on me, which I'm not sure I handled well because I attempted to speak about it on the phone for a couple hours.

I was fairly pissed off about her little ambush so I stonewalled her for 4 days until she wrote and apologized. This episode came out of the blue and was ridiculous and based on huge assumptions. This was the test I think.

As a result, I said that I wanted all future relationship discussions to happen in person, not by email or over the phone. And we cut back seeing each other to 1 or 2 nights a week. I was relinquishing ground here but to be honest, this is what I wanted at the time anyway. I was still a little pissed off but not sure what to do about it.

Last week, she invited me over, got all dressed up with make up and took me out for dinner, making a huge deal out of it, even talking about going to bed later. We had a great evening, sitting around and I played guitar along to her favorites. Perhaps we stayed up a little too late. She was in good spirits. But that night... no sex. Not in the affectionate mood or too tired or something like that. So I went to sleep and brought it up the next day, that after not seeing her for a week and having a great evening, it seemed odd that she didn't want sex, nor did she in the morning. I held firm that to be in a relationship, I required that she be healthy enough for sex or at least willing to work toward that. She would have to deal with her depression and accept that my commitment to my show was not a lack of commitment to the relationship and was short term. End result: we broke up. But strangely, I feel proud of myself, albiet a little disappointed. I walked from an 8 because she wouldn't give me what I wanted out of the relationship. It's bittersweet.

Scenario 2) Been reading pages 65 to 67 of your first book again. Last weekend I went to karaoke to cheer up from girl #1 and ended up closing with a kiss and got a number from a new girl. I asked when a good time to call her was (being a bit rusty I guess) and she said "tuesday" so I called her on tuesday. Left a message. She facebooks me and fb friends me. I called her again and no answer. I didn't leave a message but wrote her on facebook to say, "ok I called you twice, now message me somehow and let me know if you want to go out friday evening or friday for lunch" I know I screwed up by calling too soon but the "call me on tuesday" parting with a kiss was hard to ignore. Now I'm overbalanced with no ground to go too. Shoot.

These twisted tales we weave. et me know what you think. Can either be saved or do I just live and learn? Thank you.

ANSWER: Hello Paul!

I had to laugh at your subject line! Yes, I know that sometimes women seem "sinister". In fact, they aren't - they simply have a different way of going about getting the same things that you want.

Let's get to your questions:

Scenario #1: This was actually her trying to tell you (in her own "sinister" way that she was really into you. Just as you didn't see this (and I'll explain it more in a second), she didn't see how important the sex was to you. I'll bet she sees it now, but frankly, you screwed up here.

You see, while you use sex to give and receive love and closeness, she doesn't see it that way. She doesn't understand how you work any more than than most guys understand men! (Sheesh! How do guys and girls get together anyway, considering how little most understand about the other???)

By setting up the date, taking you out, being close and friendly, etc., she thought she was telling you (in her own language) how important you are to her. Now, if she had just finished that up with a blowjob, there wouldn't have been a problem at all and you'd still have been together. She simply doesn't understand how or why that's important.

Scenario #2: There were a number of mistakes here. First of all, when she told you to call her on Tuesday, you need to understand that's a set-up. She KNEW you were going to call her when she asked - and you shouldn't have done that. Ideally, you should have said, "No, I'm not a trained dog, jumping through a hoop. I'll call you when I get some free time."

Not only would this have taken away that little game, it would have put you back in the driver's seat.

Paul, as you know, I put a lot of emphasis on men running this show. It's not that women can't or won't or shouldn't. In fact, it's that they don't want to. When women try to hold on to this sort of power, ultimately, they feel cheated - by the guy that let's them have it! I've even talked to women that claimed they DID want it only to find out that the only guys they've ever loved wouldn't let it go!

She's avoiding you now as well and has moved things to Facebook in order to further try to game you. Don't let that happen!

Back to girl #1...

You can resurrect this if you want to. It'll take going back to her and saying, "You know, I screwed up. I didn't realize what you were doing with the date you set-up. I didn't see it through your eyes and I'm sorry for that. Of course, you didn't see it through my eyes either, but that's not the point."

Then, you can put things back together with her by getting together over a drink or whatever if you want.

With girl #2...

You can move this forward by mostly ignoring her on FB. Respond shortly to her specific messages, but nothing more. Don't give her that as a tool to further manipulate you. You have to take away that control.

Further, give her at least a week of zero-contact. Then, call her up. If she doesn't answer the phone, DO NOT leave a message! She'll be left wondering what you wanted - and what she missed. Give her ANOTHER week of zero-contact before you call again.

You have to use time as your ally here. If you react to the games she throws at you, she's the one in charge - not you. That simply means that you lose all the power in her book. If you instead, work your OWN plan, you can get all of that back.

Ultimately, you're going to have to decide which one (or both!) you want and respond accordingly.

Best regards...

Dr. Dennis W. Neder
President
~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.
Remington Publications
BAM! TV
818.334.8826
http://beingaman.com
http://beingaman.tv
Publishers of "Being a Man in a Woman's World I & II"
Producers of "BAM! TV"

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Thanks. I'm not sure how to deal with the depression issues with girl number one. I mean I get a little under the weather from time to time too but it doesn't last more than a day or two. When it goes on for 3 weeks, and I have to pry to find out what's going on, I guess my patience runs thin. Perhaps that's the underlying problem for me, my patience, and I think it's related to my track record. 36 and still hoping for kids and tired of the playa bitches that have dangled me along and wasted my time. I remember that I asked for the specific reason as to why she wasn't feeling attracted now when there was a strong attraction in the beginning and she said, she "was really horny after a year with no sex" - charming hey? Yet I was very clear that I was looking for long term on our first date. Her comment made it sound like all she wanted was a fling and that got my back up. It felt like another setup after the first ambush.

It's like this "bullshit alert" starts going off in my head. With girl number one I'd like to say that she should get some help and that I'd like to know how I'm supposed to be a partner if it's all about her all the time but that was the conversation we started that ended up killing the relationship. She sensed it as an attack I think. Perhaps her past has contributed to that. I dunno, great girl but I don't want to be a carpet or a bystander in a downward spiral. I am a compassionate guy but I need some return not where someone's prerequisite needs preclude my own.

Thanks for helping me out. I'll think about this some more and figure something out or move on.

Answer
Hello again Paul!

First, a couple of points:

You don't deal with her depression. She needs to get it handled through meds and/or counselor visits. You're supposed to be her boyfriend - not her therapist, right?

Second, You can make your goals as clear as you want on the first date or second date or 20th date. However, you can't set goals for anyone else, you can only set them for yourself. The first few dates are about determining what this woman wants in HER life and seeing if they match yours (from BAM2). Then, and only then, do you proceed to build something.

What I'm guessing you're doing is just the opposite. You probably tell her, "I want kids" and then see if she reacts positively. In fact, that's backwards. What you want to do is to ask her generic questions - that include timeframes. From here, you get an idea of whether she wants what you want.

You see, if you lead her like this (and she's interested in you) of course she's going to agree! There's no discovery in all of that at all - only compliance.

Paul, you (and most guys) are quick to try to solve problems when in fact, the best solution is sometimes simply to walk. When you see that it's not going to be a mutually-beneficial situation it may very well be time to find someone else.

If you haven't done it yet, I strongly encourage you to download and run these girls through the Rating Instrument from my website: http://beingaman.com/rating_instrument.asp

This tool will help you see:

1) Just how compatible she is with your goals.
2) Specifically, in what areas she's not compatible
3) How much work it's going to be to get her there - if at all
4) And, whether it's worth the effort.

You can also get a hand-version of the Rating Instrument from BAM2.

Bottom line: your goals are written in concrete, but your plans in sand. If this girl doesn't meet your goals, you change your plan and find someone new that will. If you keep this as your primary focus, you'll get what you want - and deserve to have.

Best regards...

Dr. Dennis W. Neder
President
~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.
Remington Publications
BAM! TV
818.334.8826
http://beingaman.com
http://beingaman.tv
Publishers of "Being a Man in a Woman's World I & II"
Producers of "BAM! TV"