Baptists/Old Covenant

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Question
Hi,

I have had a Jewish person tell me that the New Covenant cannot replace the Old Covenant because the Mosaic Covenant was supposed to be eternal. He sited the following Biblical quotes to prove his argument. What do you say? How can the New Covenant of grace and of Jesus Christ replace the Old Covenant, when the Old Covenant was supposed to be eternal. Please look at the Bible quotes I have listed below, which someone else has pointed out to me.

GENESIS 17:9-10 - "God said to abraham, 'and as for you, you shall keep my covenant-you and your offsrping after you THROUGHOUT THEIR GENERATIONS"
 
EXODUS 31:16 - "the children of Israel shall observe the sabbath, to make the sabbath an ETERNAL covenant for their generations"

DEUTERONOMY 11:1 - "you shall love H-shem, your G-d, and you shall safeguard his charge, his decrees, his ordinances, and his commandment, ALL THE DAYS"

DEUTERONOMY 28:46 - "they (the commandments) will be a sign and a wonder, in you and in your offsrping, FOREVER"

DEUTERONOMY 29:28 - "the hidden (sins) are for H-shem, our G-D, but the revealed (sins) are for us and our children FOREVER, to carry out all the words of this torah"

PSALM 111:7-9 - "his handiwork is truth and justice, faithful are all his orders, they are steadfast FOREVER, for ETERNITY, accomplished in truth and fairness. he sent redemption to his people; he commanded his covenant for eternity"

2 KINGS 17:37 - "and the decrees and the laws, and the torah and the commandment that he wrote for you, you shall OBSERVE TO DO ALL THE DAYS; and you shall not fear the gods of others""

Thanks: Alex

Answer
Alex, thank you for your question, but your Jewish friend is all mixed up. He is probably a traditional Jew and lives in the past of the Old Covenant, whereas the Messianic Jews has accepted Jesus as Savior and Lord and lives in the New Covenant. All born again believers are in the dispensation of the Church and the New Covenant. There is a some crossovers of the some of the old covenants in the OT into the new covenants, and some of these things foreshadow the coming Messiah and the beginning of the New Covenant made by Jesus. The Mosaic Covenant is no longer in effect and was the only conditional covenant. Your Jewish friend is mixed up on which covenant is which, so let’s shed some light on the What is a Covenant, what are the covenants, and how do they fit into the New Covenant that we live in today. Your Jewish friend does not know his Bible.

WHAT IS A COVENANT?

  “A covenant is an agreement between two parties and represents relationships formed between God and man, man and man, or nation and nation. Scriptures identifies two kinds of covenants, conditional and unconditional. A conditional covenant is binding on both parties for its fulfillment, that is, the response of the one making the covenant is conditioned by the response of the party with whom the covenant was made. An unconditional covenant is only binding on the one who makes the covenant, although certain blessings attached to the unconditional covenant may require some response from the party with which the covenant was made in order for that party to receive the blessing. There are four characteristics that must be noticed concerning the nature of the covenants: (1) they are literal, (2) they are eternal, (3) they depend entirely on the integrity of God, and (4) they were made with the covenant people, Israel” (Couch). All the covenants are unconditional except the Mosaic Covenant. So that tell you right there that the Mosaic Covenant was limited covenant.

NAME OF THE COVENANT AND HOW THEY FIT INTO GOD’S ECONONMY.

ADAMIC COVENANT

  The first covenant was the Adamic Covenant is an unconditional covenant which is broken down into two parts: the Edenic Covenant (innocence) and the Adamic Covenant (grace). The Edenic Covenant is found in Genesis 1:26-30; 2:16-17. The details of this covenant include the following:

Mankind (male and female) created in God’s image.
Mankind’s dominion (rule) over the animal kingdom.
Divine directive for mankind to reproduce and inhabit the entire Earth.
Mankind to be vegetarian (eating of meat established in the Noahic covenant: Genesis 9:3).
Eating the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil forbidden (with death as the stated penalty).

The Adamic Covenant is found in Genesis 3:16-19. As the result of Adam’s sin, the following curses were pronounced:

Enmity between Satan and Eve and her descendants.
Painful childbirth for women.
Marital strife.
The soil cursed.
Introduction of thorns and thistles.
Survival to be a struggle.
Death introduced.
Death will be the inescapable fate of all living things.

In the Adamic Covenant,  God promises that one born of a woman would be wounded in the process of destroying Satan. The “seed” of the woman who would crush the Serpent’s head is none other than Jesus Christ (see Galatians 4:4 and 1 John 3:8). Even in the midst of the curse, God’s gracious provision of salvation shines through.

NOAHIC COVENANT

  The Noahic Covenant (Gen. 9:1-18) is a unconditional covenant. This is a perpetual agreement made with Noah in which God promises to never again destroy the earth by a flood. It is an unconditional covenant.
  But the earth will be destroyed next time by fire. Apostle Peter mentions this old earth being destroyed by fire in 2 Peter 3:12-13 which states “looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be destroyed by burning, and the elements will melt with intense heat! But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells.” This burning with fire will be after the millennial reign, Satan, False Prophet, Antichrist, and all unbelievers from the beginning of time will be placed in the fiery furnace of Hell. Then there will be a new heaven and new earth, and the New Jerusalem will come out of Heaven.
  Isa. 65:17-19 and Psa. 102:25-27 talk about the New Heaven and New Earth also.

  In the Noahic Covenant, God also mediated the theocratic kingdom the administration of justice. Noah instituted capital punishment as a recognition of the sanctity of life.

ABRAHAMIC COVENANT

  The Abrahamic Covenant (Gen. 12:1-15:17) is an unconditional covenant. This unconditional covenant is progressive in its fulfillment and consists of three subcovenants, the Palestinian Covenant, Davidic Covenant, and the New Covenant. These three subconvenants contain the prophecies concerning the land (Palestinian Covenant in Deut. 30:1-10), the seed (the Davidic Covenant in 2 Sam. 7:12-16), and the blessing (the New Covenant mentioned in Jer. 31:31-34).

  Besides giving the promises of the land, seed, and blessing through the Ahrahamic Covenant, God blessed Abraham as the Father of a nation through whom God would one day administer His rule over the World.

  Alex, I will come back to the Palesinian, Davidic, and New Covenant, but I want to keep them in order of their presentation in the Bible.

MOSAIC COVENANT

  The Mosaic Covenant is the only conditional covenant which is in Exod. 20:1-31:18). The fulfillment of this conditional covenant is based on himan obedience and faithfulness to God. This covenant was broken almost immediately after it was made (Exod. 32:15-29).
  
  The Mosaic Covenant is a conditional covenant made between God and the nation of Israel at Mount Sinai (Exodus 19-24). It is sometimes called the Sinai Covenant but is more often referred to as the Mosaic Covenant since Moses was God’s chosen leader of Israel at that time. The pattern of the covenant is very similar to other ancient covenants of that time because it is between a sovereign king (God) and his people or subjects (Israel). At the time of the covenant, God reminded the people of their obligation to be obedient to His law (Exodus 19:5), and the people agreed to the covenant when they said, “All that the Lord has spoken we will do!” (Exodus 19:8). This covenant would serve to set the nation of Israel apart from all other nations as God’s chosen people and was as equally binding as the unconditional covenant that God made with Abraham because it is also a blood covenant. The Mosaic Covenant is a significant covenant in both God’s redemptive history and in the history of the nation of Israel through whom God would sovereignly chose to bless the world with both His written Word and the Living Word, Jesus Christ.
  The Mosaic Covenant was centered around God's giving His divine law to Moses on Mount Sinai. In understanding the different covenants in the Bible and their relationship with one another, it is important to understand that the Mosaic Covenant differs significantly from the Abrahamic Covenant and later biblical covenants because it is conditional in that the blessings that God promises are directly related to Israel’s obedience to the Mosaic Law. If Israel is obedient, then God will bless them, but if they disobey, then God will punish them. The blessings and curses that are associated with this conditional covenant are found in detail in Deuteronomy 28. The other covenants found in the Bible are unilateral covenants of promise, in which God binds Himself to do what He promised, regardless of what the recipients of the promises might do. On the other hand the Mosaic Covenant is a bilateral agreement, which specifies the obligations of both parties to the covenant.
  The Mosaic Covenant is especially significant because in it God promises to make Israel “a kingdom of priests and a holy nation” (Exodus 19:6). Israel was to be God’s light to the dark world around them. They were to be a separate and called-out nation so that everyone around them would know that they worshiped Yahweh, the covenant-keeping God. It is significant because it is here that Israel received the Mosaic Law that was to be a schoolmaster pointing the way towards the coming of Christ (Galatians 3:24-25).

  Alex, your Jewish friend needs to listen up on this point as he is missing it greatly. The Mosaic Law would reveal to people their sinfulness and their need for a Savior, and it is the Mosaic Law that Christ Himself said that He did not come to abolish but to fulfill.
  Most Jews miss this point. The Mosaic Law did not save one person, but it was their faith in God Almighty that saved them. But because Israel put some much faith in the Mosaic Law, it became a legalistic religion, and made its focus of living out the 613 Mosaic Laws instead of having a faith in the Living God.
  The Mosaic Law laid down the foundation for the coming Messiah to come and die on the cross for the sins of the world, because people put their faith into religion, not God, they were still sinners who worshiped the religion and not God, and so Jesus had to come and die on the cross for the sins of the world. Because of worshipping the religion of the Mosaic Law and its 613 laws, the Pharisees thought of themselves as being more holy than anyone else and worshiped the system and not God, and used the law to be in Moses seat (Matt. 23:2) and judged people. Jesus condemned the Pharisees for this mentioning this in the eight woes given in Matthew Chapter 23, and Jesus told the Pharisees in Matt. 23:23 “have omitted the weightier [matters] of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.”
  Alex, your Jewish friend is just like the Pharisees, he is worshipping religion (the Mosaic Law) and not the Savior. You need to remember and the Jewish person needs to learn, the Mosaic Law saves no one. In fact, worshipping the Mosaic Law as a religion will send you to Hell. Jesus said in John 14:6 “I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.” It is only by faith in Jesus will one be saved, not the Mosaic Law.
  Putting in  a different way. This is an important point because some people get confused by thinking that keeping the Law saved people in the Old Testament, but the Bible is clear that salvation has always been by faith alone, and the promise of salvation by faith that God had made to Abraham as part of the Abrahamic Covenant still remained in effect (Galatians 3:16-18).

  People do the same thing today. They worship some stupid Apostate Preacher, or some high church religion and they think they are saved but they are not. The Religious System will not save you, but the SAVIOR will.

  Remember the Mosaic Law was fulfilled by Jesus as he stated in Matt. 5:17 “Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.” Jesus fulfilled law completely “For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled” (Matt. 5:18). Jesus fulfilled the Mosaic Law down to the last jot and tittle. We would say today, “down to the last period and comma.”
  Jews forget about this but God used the Law of Moses, Law of the Prophets, and psalms to foretell about Jesus as stated in Lk 24:24 “And he said unto them, These [are] the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and [in] the prophets, and [in] the psalms, concerning me.”

THE PALESTINIAN COVENANT


  The Palestinian Covenant (Deut. 28-30) is an unconditional covenant. It guarantees that Israel will possess the Promised Land. This covenant deals with the blessing of the Land that was stated in Abrahamic Covenant.

  Besides the promises that God would bless them if they obeyed His commandments and curse them if they disobeyed, the Palestinian Covenant also contains some special promises to Israel that many believe will not be completely fulfilled until the millennial reign of Christ. First, God promised to gather the scattered Israelites from all over the world and to bring them back into the land He had promised to their ancestors (Deuteronomy 30:3-5). Second, God promised to regenerate the Israelites of that time and their descendants by circumcising their hearts so that they would love Him totally (Deuteronomy 30:6). Third, God promised to judge Israel’s enemies (Deuteronomy 30:7), and, fourth, He promised that the Israelites would obey God and that God would prosper them in their obedience (Deuteronomy 30:8-9). While some might see these promises being fulfilled when Israel was returned from captivity in Babylon at the time of Ezra and Nehemiah, there seem to be some aspects of this that have not been fully realized yet.

For example, the promised restoration of Israel to the land would not happen until all the blessings and curses promised them were fulfilled (Deuteronomy 30:1), and we know that Israel as a nation rejected Jesus Christ as their Messiah and was once again cursed and cut off from the land when the Romans conquered Jerusalem in A.D. 70. Second, we see that one of the promises in this covenant was that God would circumcise their hearts (Deuteronomy 30:6) so that they and their descendents would obey Him (Deuteronomy 30:8). These same promises are repeated in Jeremiah 32:36-44 and Ezekiel 36:22-38 and are part of the blessings and promises of the New Covenant. Also, it seems that the final or ultimate restoration of Israel to the land and to an everlasting relationship with God is what Paul is looking forward to in Romans 11:25-26 when he says that “a partial hardening has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in and thus all Israel will be saved.”

The Palestinian Covenant also serves to reinforce the promises made to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob that God would establish Israel as His chosen people (Deuteronomy 29:13). Even though God set before Israel the promise of His blessings for obedience and His curses for disobedience, He knew full well they would turn from Him and His covenant and turn to idols. This is why He also promised to one day restore them to the land and have compassion on them (Deuteronomy 30:1-3). Therefore, the ultimate outcome of this covenant does not depend on Israel and its obedience, but instead it depends on God and His faithfulness. The Palestinian Covenant focuses on what God is going to do more than what Israel is supposed to do. While Israel’s prosperity is closely tied to her obedience to God’s commands, and they will still be punished for their disobedience to God, there is coming a day when God will return them to the land (the full extent of the land as outlined in Genesis 15:18-21), and they will possess it, and God will bless them forever.

At that time God will circumcise their hearts so they will obey Him (Deuteronomy 30:6). This covenant is again reaffirming the Abrahamic Covenant in that someday the seed of Abraham will possess the Promised Land forever. Unlike the Mosaic Covenant whose promises are conditional upon Israel’s obedience to the Law, ultimate fulfillment of the promises of the Palestinian Covenant are not dependent upon Israel’s obedience. Instead, the Palestinian Covenant is an unconditional, eternal covenant (Ezekiel 16:60) because it is a part of the Abrahamic Covenant and an amplification of it.

THE DAVIDIC COVENANT

  The Davidic Covenant (2 Sam. 7:4-16; 1 Chron. 17:3-5). This unconditional covenant promises that David’s throne, lineage, and kingdom will be eternal. It assures the millennial kingdom in which Christ will reign on the earth. This the seed blessing mentioned in the Abrahamic Covenant.

  The Davidic Covenant refers to God’s promises to David through Nathan the prophet and is found in 2 Samuel 7 and later summarized in 1 Chronicles 17:11-14 and 2 Chronicles 6:16. This is an unconditional covenant made between God and David through which God promises David and Israel that the Messiah (Jesus Christ) would come from the lineage of David and the tribe of Judah and would establish a kingdom that would endure forever (2 Samuel 7:10-13). The Davidic Covenant is unconditional because God does not place any conditions of obedience upon its fulfillment. The surety of the promises made rests solely on God’s faithfulness and does not depend at all on David or Israel’s obedience.

The Davidic Covenant centers on several key promises that are made to David. 1) God reaffirms the promise of the land that He made in the first two covenants with Israel (the Abrahamic and Mosaic Covenants). This promise is seen in 2 Samuel 7:10, “Moreover I will appoint a place for My people Israel, and will plant them, that they may dwell in a place of their own and move no more; nor shall the sons of wickedness oppress them anymore, as previously.” 2) God promises that David’s descendant or “seed” will succeed him as king of Israel and that David’s throne will be established forever. This promise is seen in 2 Samuel 7:12-13, "I will set up your seed after you, who will come from your body, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build a house for My name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever.” This is a reference to the coming Messiah, Jesus Christ.

The provisions of the covenant are summarized in 2 Samuel 7:16, “And your house and your kingdom shall be established forever before you. Your throne shall be established forever.” The promise that David’s “house,” “kingdom” and “throne” will be established forever is significant because it shows that the Messiah will come from the lineage of David and that He will establish a kingdom from which He will reign. The covenant is summarized by the words “house,” promising a dynasty in the lineage of David; “kingdom,” referring to a people who are governed by a king; “throne,” emphasizing the authority of the king’s rule; and “forever,” emphasizing the eternal and unconditional nature of this promise to David and Israel.

NEW COVENANT

  The New Covenant is the “blessing” mentioned in the Abrahamic Covenant is unconditional. It is first mentioned in Jer. 31:31-32 which states “Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day [that] I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD.”
  Jesus Christ came to fulfill the law of Moses (Matthew 5:17) and create a new covenant between God and His people. The old covenant was written in stone, but the new covenant is written on our hearts, made possible only by faith in Christ, who shed His own blood to atone for the sins of the world. Luke 22:20 says, "After supper, [Jesus] took another cup of wine and said, 'This wine is the token of God's new covenant to save you – an agreement sealed with the blood I will pour out for you.'"
  Now that we are under the new covenant, we are not under the penalty of the law. We are now given the opportunity to receive salvation as a free gift (Ephesians 2:8-9). Through the life-giving Holy Spirit who lives in all believers (Romans 8:9-11), we can now share in the inheritance of Christ and enjoy a permanent, unbroken relationship with God. Hebrews 9:15 declares, “For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.”

  Alex, this is a small synopsis of all the Covenants, and I am not going to comment on the verses you listed as they are insignificant anyway. I hope this gives you a little better understanding. I hope this helps in your understanding of the what a covenant is and the different covenants themselves.
  Now you will know that when a Jewish person tells you  “that the New Covenant cannot replace the Old Covenant because the Mosaic Covenant was supposed to be eternal,” then you can tell them they do not know crap. The Mosaic Covenant is over and we live in under the New Covenant. If a Jew is living under the Mosaic Covenant, then will miss going to Heaven, because Jesus is the only way to Heaven and not a belief in 613 Laws.

  Blessings to you today,

Dr Don Howe, RN, PhD, ThD  

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Dr Don Howe

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I welcome questions that deal with theological issues, relationship issues, church history, world religions, current events from a Christian worldview, "gray areas" that are present today, church growth movements, false prophets, spiritual abuse issues, end time events, prophecy, medical ethical issues, hermeneutical questions, and how Israel fits into God's economy today. I will answer all questions in a grammatical/historical normative interpretation of God's Word. If I can not answer a question, I will do the research and find the answer if available. If you are looking for a liberal theological answer or agrument, do not ask. I am not an expert on church planting or evangelism.

Experience

I have over 27 years of experience doing ministry as a bivocational minster/professional nurse. I do ministry as a volunteer with ministries that are nonprofit and not able to pay for ministers. I have experience working with youth, children, elderly in different placement settings, mentally ill and mentally challenged in different settings, felons in state prison and county jails, hospital chaplancy, choir ministry, and deacon ministry. I am an ordained SBC minister. I am a Professional Chaplain. I am currently doing hospital minstry, ministry to shut-ins, and a chaplain with Victim Relief Ministry working with victims of diasters and domestic violence. I work as psychiatric nurse in large county jail system.

Organizations
American Association of Christian Counselors, Baptist Nursing Fellowship, Nurses Christian Fellowship, Therpon Institute, Victim Chaplain & Counselor Association of America, International Board of Christian Counselors, American Society of Christian Therapists.

Publications
N/A

Education/Credentials
PhD, Therapon University, USVI, 12/07 in Biblical Counseling, DCC, Southwest Bible College & Seminary, Jenning, LA 04/05 in Christian Psychology and Counseling. ThD, Slidell Baptist Seminary, Slidell, LA 02/04 D.D., Slidell Baptist Seminary, Slidell, LA 07/03 Tyndale Seminary, Fort Worth, TX 2001-2003 BSN, Univ. of Texas in Arlington, Tx 05/93 ADN, Midwestern State Univ., Wichitia Falls, TX 5/77 Covenant Medical Center in Lubbock, Externship 08/04-12/05, 4 units of CPE earned.

Awards and Honors
Board Certified Christian Counselor by International Board of Christian Counselors. Issued 01/24/06.

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