Expert: Pastor Don Carpenter - 1/29/2010

Question
QUESTION: Hi Pastor,

I have heard many people say that tithing should be on someone's gross income, instead of on the net. But Paul, in his second letter to Timothy, said: "The hardworking farmer should be the first to receive a share of the crops."

This statement alone means that if you work for a living, you, being the worker, should be the first to get what you have worked for, at least as it is according to the grace that we are under in the New Testament. Regardless of what Paul is speaking about, he is making a comparison statement, and therefore the comparison has to be true, which is that the worker should get the first fruits of his labor, not the Church. It goes along well with what Paul says to the Corinthians: "Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver." In other words, in the New Testament, the fruits of the laborer first go to the laborer, and then he gets to decide how he gives it away. God gives us this grace in the New Testament.

It goes along well with: "Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously." If you sow sparingly you will reap sparingly, but you will still reap...if you tithe or not you will still reap. It means that God will bless any amount that is given, and not only a tithe.

Please comment on this.

Thank you!!

ANSWER: Hi Kurt,

I am not exactly sure where your Second Timothy passage is.  I am very familiar with the King James, and not some of the other translations.  I think you may be speaking of this passage:

1 Timothy 5:18
... And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

If this is the passage, you must understand the context.

1 Timothy 5:17-18
17 Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine. 18 For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

Paul was saying that pastors should be paid, just like Oxen eat the food that falls to the ground when they plow.  This verse has nothing to do with tithing.  Proverbs tells us to honor the Lord with our firstfruits.  There is nothing in the New Testament that counters that.  Jesus commanded that we should tithe, even down to giving 10% of our spices!

Matthew 23:23
23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.  
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

Jesus commanded not to leave this tithing undone!  The key thing to remember is that tithing is just the beginning.  The tithe already belongs to God.  If we purpose to give above that, GOd will reward us according to our faith.

Malachi 3:8-11
8 Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. 9 Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. 10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.  11 And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts.  
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

I hope that this helps you.

In Christ
Pastor Don

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: The passage is 2 Timothy 2:6...

Can you now answer the question....thanks

Malachi is specifically addressed to the nation of Israel. If you look at the Matthew 23:23 passage as it it written in Luke it says: "But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone." It specifically says that tithing is part of the Old Testament Law of Moses. The other matters of the law, like judgment and the love of God passed over into the New Testament Church, because we can see that in other passages in the New Testament, but Tithing did not pass over from the Law into the New Testament, because outside of these passages in Matthew and Luke where Jesus condemns the Pharisees for being hypocrites, tithing is not even mentioned to proscribed for NT believers. In the Matthew and Luke passage Jesus is telling the Pharisees how they should have respected the Mosaic Law since they were under the Law of Moses, but not that it is part of the age of grace brought by Christ. Jesus specifically says in Luke that it is the Law. If you look at the 2 Timothy 2:6 passage it is clear that in the age of grace God has given us the grace to be the first ones to receive the fruits of our labor, and then we are to choose on our own what we do with it. It is up to us, and God trusts us enough to let it be voluntary. Jacob tithed voluntarily, not under compulsion, and Abraham is only recorded to have tithed once, and it was on war booty of all things. Abraham's tithe was voluntary too.

If this is not the case, then how do you explain away the 2 Timothy 2:6 passage? How do you explain away what Paul said to the Corinthians: Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver...Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously."

Therefore it must be voluntary in the New Testament, not mandatory. If you sow sparingly you will reap sparingly, but you will still reap.

Please respond...Thanks!!


ANSWER: Hi Kurt,

Thanks for this question.  It is true that there are good men on both sides of this issue.  It is my belief that the 2 Timothy passage has nothing to do with tithing or not tithing, but rather with living a separated life for God, winning souls.  There is nothing in this that takes the tithe away.

2 Timothy 2:3-7
3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ. 4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier. 5 And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully. 6 The husbandman that laboureth must be first partaker of the fruits.  7 Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things.

The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

Yes the tithe was a part of the law of Moses, but it was not exclusive to the law of Moses.  Abraham tithed in Genesis 18 way before Moses.  This was not commanded in the law, but was observed anyway.  The Corinthian passage gives the same principle of Malachi... God blesses those who give and limits blessings to those who do not.  If you study the context of the Corinthian passage, you will see that this is a collection given to missionaries, not money used to support the local church (the church is called the house of God in the New Testament).  Malachi tells us that the money is for "My house" and we know that this house is the church now.

1 Timothy 3:15
15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.  
The King James Version, (Cambridge: Cambridge) 1769.

If you choose to not believe in tithing in the New Testament, fine.  Grace is given to give us the ability to do what the law could not allow.  Most Christians I know give much more than the tithe.  I think that the way to look at it is the tithe is the bare minimum, and grace allows you to do much much more.

I hope that this helps you.

In Christ
Pastor Don

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Hi Pastor,

I do not think that Paul is talking about tithing in 2 Timothy 2:6, but Paul is stating something he felt was true under the New Testament's covenant of grace, and that is that in this time of grace the first fruits belong to the laborer, and God is now trusting us to distribute it properly. No longer do the first fruits belong to the Levites and priests, but to the laborer, and God is trusting us in the covenant of grace to distribute it properly.

In 2 Timothy 2:6 Paul makes a comparative statement, but for that comparison to be true it would mean that the first fruits of the farmer have to belong to him, and not to the Levites, priests, church. If that is not the case then Paul's comparison is worthless. For A to be true B has to be true too.

In the Law of Moses the first fruits belonged to the priests and Levites, but not so under the covenant of grace. We know this from Paul's statement. So therefore if we discuss tithing we have to believe that it cannot manditorily be on gross income, because the gross belongs to the laborer, and then he has the freedom to distribute it as he believes in right in his heart.

Abraham only tithed once, and it wasn't on income, but on war booty. This is a weak example for telling people that manditory tithing transcends the law. When Abraham tithed that one time there is absolutely no reason to think that it was anything but voluntary. When Jacob told God he would tithe he made certain demands on God. If it was manditory he could not and would not have made any demands. Living in the modern day you cannot tell the authorities that you will obey the law only if they do this or that in return. To make demands on someone in exchange for something only happens when a voluntary agreement is made, and not when someone is following a manditory edict. Therefore tithing before the Law of Moses was voluntary due to what we see in Abraham's and Jacob's examples. It could not be otherwise.

You quoted Malachi 3 in a previous message. Malachi 3 says that the nation of Israel would be curses for not tithing, and that the nation would be blessed if it tithed. But there no Christians washed by the blood of Christ are under any curse. The only curse is if they follow the law, and that would include manditorily tithing. Christ redeemed us from the law, which include manditory tithing, and we know this because in Luke's passage Jesus said that tithing is part of the law. I have heard that moral aspects of the law were reiterated in the New Testament, such as not killing, etc. But tithing is not a moral aspect. In the Epistles tithing is never mentioned as a teaching for Christians to follow. Never. In Hebrews it is only mentioned to teach about Jesus, but in Hebrews the author never says that Christians must do it. And the only time Jesus ever mentions tithing in the Gospels is to criticize how the Pharisees were hypocrites in the way they followed the Law of Moses. You can't say that Jesus praised them for tithing in this passage, because he is criticizing them. You don't praise someone by saying "woe" to him. And if Jesus said it is part of the Law, then it was nailed to his cross on calvary, and so therefore cannot be mandatory.

Christians are under no curse. And following the law as if it is still in effect is a curse:  Galatians 3:10-13 - "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree."

So as Christians we are freed from the law and under no curse and as laborers in the covenant of grace we are to have the first fruits of our labor, not the Levites or priests, and God trusts us to be proper stewarts of the fruits of that labor. Abraham may have voluntarily tithed once, and Jacob tithed voluntarily on a regular basis. But it is clear that in both cases it was voluntary, therefore saying that manditory tithing transcends the law is impossible. It is bad interpretation. Therefore tithing in the modern day, for New Testament Christians, cannot be mandatory.

Tithing is good, but it is not mandatory and cannot be from what is taught in scripture. I am not against tithing, I'm only arguing that it is not mandatory.

Please respond and let me know what you think!!

Answer
Hi Kurt,

I believe that we are going to have to agree to disagree.  You are right that we as Christians are not under the curse of the law, but certainly we face the mighty hand of Gods' correction as His children when we disobey Him.  This is not the curse of the law, but it is chastisement.

Hebrews 12:5-8
5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him: 6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. 7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? 8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
The King James Version, #Cambridge: Cambridge# 1769.

I believe that the more you give the more you get so that you can give more.  I believe that if you with hold from God, then He will not trust you with more.  These principles are all through out the New Testament.  Tithing is the first little baby step in giving.  If one has a problem with this baby step, they will never get to the incredible blessings of grace giving.  Whether or not one believes it is mandatory, certainly it is a minimum.  New Testament Christians were selling their land and giving all of the money to meet needs in the community.  Surely that blows the concept of the tithe away.  Yes I know that was not the norm nor was it required, but I think that we quibble about the tithe, when most New Testament giving was much greater than that.  I respect your opinion that tithing is not for today.  I disagree... and that is fine.  I do not wish to argue further about it if you do not mind. I hope that this helps you.  Thank you for finding me on facebook.

In Christ
Pastor Don