Expert: Dennis Herman - 8/26/2008

Question
QUESTION: An Atheist asked me if your God Jesus is love and love us then why He command Saul to killed every one including women and infant of Amalek ?

1 Samuel Chapter 15
15:2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.

15:3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.


ANSWER: An Atheist asked me if your God Jesus is love and love us then why He command Saul to killed every one including women and infant of Amalek ?

1 Samuel Chapter 15
15:2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.

15:3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.

This question calls for a long and detailed answer that is not simple to put into words without action.  The first step to address a question is to look and see what information the Bible will supply concerning Amalek.  If we understand the back ground we may be able to understand the outcome.  

A word search of Amalek will show us the following verses.  

KJV Exodus 17:8-9
8.  Then came Amalek, and fought with Israel in Rephidim.
9.  And Moses said unto Joshua, Choose us out men, and go out, fight with Amalek: to morrow I will stand on the top of the hill with the rod of God in mine hand.

Amalek waged war against Israel, God's people.  You can ask yourself the question, if God is a God of love, would He allow His people to be slain?

KJV Numbers 14:42-45
42.  Go not up, for the Lord is not among you; that ye be not smitten before your enemies.
43.  For the Amalekites and the Canaanites are there before you, and ye shall fall by the sword: because ye are turned away from the Lord, therefore the Lord will not be with you.
44.  But they presumed to go up unto the hill top: nevertheless the ark of the covenant of the Lord, and Moses, departed not out of the camp.
45.  Then the Amalekites came down, and the Canaanites which dwelt in that hill, and smote them, and discomfited them, even unto Hormah.

When Israel refused to follow God they were outside of His protection.  There is a lesson in this.  As your children grow and go out to experience life for themselves they often wander beyond the reach of our protection.  This is because they are out making decisions on their own.  They are responsible for their own actions and must pay the consequences.

KJV Deuteronomy 25:17-19
17.  Remember what Amalek did unto thee by the way, when ye were come forth out of Egypt;
18.  How he met thee by the way, and smote the hindmost of thee, even all that were feeble behind thee, when thou wast faint and weary; and he feared not God.
19.  Therefore it shall be, when the Lord thy God hath given thee rest from all thine enemies round about, in the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee for an inheritance to possess it, that thou shalt blot out the remembrance of Amalek from under heaven; thou shalt not forget it.

Amalek made the choice to attack the back of the Israelites.  They intentionally killed the old and feeble.  This is a decision they made.  It was a military maneuver that required planning and organization.

KJV Judges 6:3-11
3.  And so it was, when Israel had sown, that the Midianites came up, and the Amalekites, and the children of the east, even they came up against them;
4.  And they encamped against them, and destroyed the increase of the earth, till thou come unto Gaza, and left no sustenance for Israel, neither sheep, nor ox, nor ass.
5.  For they came up with their cattle and their tents, and they came as grasshoppers for multitude; for both they and their camels were without number: and they entered into the land to destroy it.
6.  And Israel was greatly impoverished because of the Midianites; and the children of Israel cried unto the Lord.
7.  And it came to pass, when the children of Israel cried unto the Lord because of the Midianites,
8.  That the Lord sent a prophet unto the children of Israel, which said unto them, Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, I brought you up from Egypt, and brought you forth out of the house of bondage;
9.  And I delivered you out of the hand of the Egyptians, and out of the hand of all that oppressed you, and drave them out from before you, and gave you their land;
10.  And I said unto you, I am the Lord your God; fear not the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but ye have not obeyed my voice.
11.  And there came an angel of the Lord, and sat under an oak which was in Ophrah, that pertained unto Joash the Abiezrite: and his son Gideon threshed wheat by the winepress, to hide it from the Midianites.

The Amalekites joined forces with others to destroy Israel.  They burned the crops and destroyed all the animals and were positioned to attack and destroy Israel.  Things were so bad the people turned to God for help.  Why do we have to wait until our lives are in complete ruin before we turn to God?

KJV Judges 6:33-34
33.  Then all the Midianites and the Amalekites and the children of the east were gathered together, and went over, and pitched in the valley of Jezreel.
34.  But the Spirit of the Lord came upon Gideon, and he blew a trumpet; and Abiezer was gathered after him.

KJV Judges 10:12
12.  The Zidonians also, and the Amalekites, and the Maonites, did oppress you; and ye cried to me, and I delivered you out of their hand.

In answer to their pleas God sent Gideon and he succeeded against impossible odds.


KJV 1 Samuel 14:47-48
47.  So Saul took the kingdom over Israel, and fought against all his enemies on every side, against Moab, and against the children of Ammon, and against Edom, and against the kings of Zobah, and against the Philistines: and whithersoever he turned himself, he vexed them.
48.  And he gathered an host, and smote the Amalekites, and delivered Israel out of the hands of them that spoiled them.

KJV 1 Samuel 15:20-21
20.  And Saul said unto Samuel, Yea, I have obeyed the voice of the Lord, and have gone the way which the Lord sent me, and have brought Agag the king of Amalek, and have utterly destroyed the Amalekites.
21.  But the people took of the spoil, sheep and oxen, the chief of the things which should have been utterly destroyed, to sacrifice unto the Lord thy God in Gilgal.

This had been a long span of history before Saul was sent to completely destroy Amalek.  The difference is, Israel kept returning to God.  Amalek never turned to God but they kept on trying to destroy Israel.  They had finally reached a point to where this pattern could no longer be repeated.  Just like the flood.  Sin reaches a pint to where no one is safe and something must be done.  Noah preached for repentance.  Few listened.  

Now to attempt the explain God's love and patience.  

KJV Revelation 7:1
1.  And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.

I will quickly go over these symbolic meanings.  The winds represent strife.  In the book of Job Satan was allowed to use the wind to strike out at Job and his family.  The earth represents God's people and the sea represents those that follow Satan.  Trees also represent people.  Notice that the winds are not allowed to harm any of these.  

KJV Revelation 7:1-3
1.  And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
2.  And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
3.  Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

As we read a little further we see that there is a time limit on God's grace.  

KJV Revelation 10:1-5
1.  And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud: and a rainbow was upon his head, and his face was as it were the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire:
2.  And he had in his hand a little book open: and he set his right foot upon the sea, and his left foot on the earth,
3.  And cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roareth: and when he had cried, seven thunders uttered their voices.
4.  And when the seven thunders had uttered their voices, I was about to write: and I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Seal up those things which the seven thunders uttered, and write them not.
5.  And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven,

Once again we see the earth (God's people) and the sea (Satan's followers) and this time we see the Angel with His hand up to Heaven.  The Angel in this case is Jesus.  He has one foot on His followers and the other on those that oppose Him.  The hand held up to Heaven represents His pleading for both classes.

KJV Matthew 9:12-13
12.  But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.
13.  But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Jesus said Himself that He came to this earth to live, work and die for sinners.  It all hinges on personal choice.  Would God have destroyed the Amalekites if they would have turned from their sins?

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Thanks but you answer according to Christian perspective not according to humanity.
we cannot gave this explanation to Atheist , Humanist , Secularist and Feminist .

Why not Loving God adopt infant instead of command to kill them ?"

Answer
Nick

I do not think it is fair to answer a question about God by using anything but the Bible.  I do not want to change the subject but the question you ask is difficult to answer.  I once read a book called, "Why do Bad Things Happen to Good People."  In hundreds of pages the author did not answer that question.  That is a question that may be answered in Heaven.

You also ask how we can explain these situations to those that do not believe.  There is a verse that may explain that question.  KJV Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

The swine and dogs represent those that do not believe in God.  The pearls represent Heaven.  No matter what you do or say they may not believe.

I think you may try going over some text with them that will give them something to think about.  Usually the first step is to establish the fact that the Bible was written by God.  You may consider using some of the following text.  



KJV John 17:17
17.  Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

KJV 2 Peter 1:21
21.  For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

KJV 1 Thessalonians 2:13
13.  For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe.

KJV 2 Timothy 3:15-17
15.  And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16.  All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17.  That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.


KJV Psalms 119:11
11.  Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.

KJV Psalms 119:160
160.  Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever.

KJV Psalms 12:6-7
6.  The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
7.  Thou shalt keep them, O Lord, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

KJV 1 Corinthians 2:12-14
12.  Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13.  Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14.  But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

KJV John 12:46-50
46.  I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.
47.  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
48.  He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
49.  For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
50.  And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

KJV Romans 15:4-6
4.  For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.
5.  Now the God of patience and consolation grant you to be likeminded one toward another according to Christ Jesus:
6.  That ye may with one mind and one mouth glorify God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

KJV Proverbs 1:2-7
2.  To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding;
3.  To receive the instruction of wisdom, justice, and judgment, and equity;
4.  To give subtilty to the simple, to the young man knowledge and discretion.
5.  A wise man will hear, and will increase learning; and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels:
6.  To understand a proverb, and the interpretation; the words of the wise, and their dark sayings.
7.  The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

I'm sorry I could not answer your question about the treatment of some people.  If I come across anything I have missed I will let you know.

Dennis Herman