Expert: Clifford H. Readout, Jr. - 4/20/2010

Question
Hello Clifford



Ezekiel 28:13-14 speaks of a being who was in Eden, who was created directly and who was annointed as a great guardian cherub - a supernatural creature. Is this passage not referring to Satan?



In verses 18 and 19, Ezekiel 28 says that this being's fate is to be set on fire and burnt to ashes so that he will be no more.

If the ultimate fate of Satan is to be turned into ashes so that he will be no more, where do we get the teaching that irredeemable human sinners are to endure the horror of burning alive forever?



Shouldn't they end up as ashes also?



I am having trouble understanding how the new Heaven and Earth are going to be perfect if they have to co-exist with a realm wherein millions of horrifically tormented beings scream out in agony forever - and who in all liklihood, would be polluting all of creation with their curses against God for continuously torturing them.



How are the residents of Heaven going to be free of torment themselves, if they know that loved ones are burning alive day and night in indescribable pain?



I have been told that supernatural mind control will be employed in Heaven, to hide the existance of such a realm from the population. I find this hard to accept.



Does not Scripture say that the Holy Spirit is committed to leading us into all truth? How can this be true if there is an intention at the same time, to conceal truth?



I am wondering if Ezekiel 28 is speaking of a final destruction of evil as opposed to the entrenching of it in a firey torture chamber as seems to be commonly believed.



What is your understanding of Ezekiel 28?



Many thanks



Richard

Answer
Dear Richard,

Please excuse the length of time I’ve taken to reply. I am recovering from some pernicious an debilitating health issues, and have not had time to work on an answer. Additionally, you ask several significant questions, not to be brushed off with casual answers. I will take the questions one at a time:

1. Ezekiel 28:13-14 … Is this passage not referring to Satan?

I believe it is. The description does not fit any other being mentioned in the Bible.
It is possible that the allegorical language could also apply to the man (Ethbaal) who was the king of Tyrus just prior to its destruction by Nebuchadnezzar. But, if that is the case, the language is extremely hyperbolic, not merely allegorical. It seems more likely to me that the language is more precise than allegorical and not hyperbolic at all. Other texts provide reason to apply this one to Satan.

2. Ezekiel 28:18-19 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. 19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

The fire and devouring mentioned is most likely an idiomatic metaphor, especially considering that it is brought forth from within, rather than put into, this being.
Being brought to ashes most likely means to bring to ruin, rather than to burn to ash.
The phrase “and never shalt thou be any more” reflects back on the phrases before it. One of the results of God’s judgment will be that he will no longer have any power to impress anyone, but serve as an alarm and proof of God’s judgment

3. The nature of the co-existence of the New Heaven and New Earth with hell needs some consideration. So also the relationship, if any, between their inhabitants. There is not much teaching about it in the Bible, but we shouldn’t ignore what there is. (There is more that tells us about the relationship between the realms of the saved and the lost before the Great White Throne Judgment than there is after it.)

I know of only one verse which relates to the subject in the time of the New Heaven and the New Earth:
Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

This text does not say that hell no longer exists. It does not contradict those texts which describe hell as enduring forever. It does say that the former things, those which would cause tears, death, sorrow, crying, or pain have departed from the experience of them who are saved. It does not specify the physics or method which separates the two realms, but it clearly states that the former things “passed away” (The Greek word literally means “to go away, depart”). It will be the result of divine action. God is going to wipe away (literally, obliterate) all tears from the eyes of the saved, both physical and spiritual.

To describe this as “supernatural mind control” actually denigrates the power of God. To suggest that He hides the facts that would offend also denigrates His character. You are right to find it hard to accept, and to reject it on that basis

4. How are the residents of Heaven going to be free of torment themselves, if they know that loved ones are burning alive day and night in indescribable pain?

The fact that we may not know “how” something can be, does not validate the assumption that it cannot be. It is the challenge of all research to discover the “how” and “why” of things we do not understand.

The question is also predicated on two assumptions:
- that the saved will know the details of the damnation of others,
- and that they will still be “loved ones” after the Great White Throne Judgment.
I don’t know that either of these assumptions are valid. Nevertheless, I will suggest an answer that would apply if they are:
Three passages tell us that every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess to God.
Isaiah 45:23 I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
Romans 14:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
Philippians 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
When will this take place?

There is an instructive passage in Jesus’ teaching about forgiveness and judgment:
Matthew 18:26 “The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.”
Worship is what you do when you are in the King’s presence. But, why worship at the time of judgment? This slave had just heard the sentence against him. He was to be sold to another king, (the other king is not so benevolent). Why then would he worship? Because he was brought to the recognition of how kind, loving, generous, and graceful his king had been to him all of his life. Who else would have given him so much provision and trusted him with so many treasures? Certainly not the only other available master! When the sinner stands in condemnation at the Great White Throne he will worship as he is brought to recognize the constant grace of God that was given to him day by day that he refused!

There will not be any cursing against God in that day. The total awareness of the absolute justice of a sentence removes the complaint against it.  There will be no one angry against God for the consequence of their own doings, especially when they become equally aware of all He did to prevent them from choosing damnation.

5. It is not wise to deny the plain statements of Scripture in favor of “spiritualizing” them simply because we do not like the conclusions they would impose. Hell is not merely an allegorical place, and its torment is not merely figurative. Consider this: The potency of hell and its terror is best defined by the price the Lord paid to give man an opportunity to avoid going there. The sacrifice of Christ does not prevent men from being damned, it only purchased the possibility of men being saved instead. (This is the real message of John 3:16. If it weren’t for the giving of the Son, even those who believe on Him would perish!) If the opportunity cost so much, how terrible must the damnation be!

So, do not conclude that hell is merely a figure of speech. It is a terrible place that will endure forever, but out of relationship with the New Heaven and the New Earth, and without intervention by the Creator.

Your question, as limited to Ezekiel 28, though, does not have to be as extreme as a denial of the reality of hell and damnation, to which I could not agree. Ezekiel 28:11-19 is not an extreme use of hyperbole referring merely to the actual king of Tyrus in that day. I do think it contains idiomatic if not allegorical language, that applies specifically to Satan, and his ultimate doom. Like most, if not all, prophetic pronouncements, it had an application for its day and one to come in a future beyond the experience of the people to whom it was first given. I think the same is true of Isaiah 14:4-23.

I do not think the fire and ash of Ezekiel 28:18-19 refers to hell or the physical demise of anyone, but to the personal torment that will rise from the heart of the one who once was the anointed cherub that covereth.

Because you also sent this question to my direct email address, I will attach a couple of studies related to this subject. Please honor my copyright.

I hope this helps.

Yours for Truth,

CR