Expert: - 1/31/2008

Question
QUESTION: i am a pretty high rev player with medium spd.. about 15mph. no matter where i seem to layout my balls i tend to track over my thumb and at times the middle finger grip. almost like my track starts at a full roller and then flares out.  my pap is 5 3/4 over and   5/8 up  and layout u can offer me to get my track left off of my thumb. any insight would be great

ANSWER: Aarik,
Yours may not be a layout issue, you may have a fit issue. Your tracking very high (we assume). Cause could be pitches of your grip, or a predisposition to come up the back of the ball, or hand rotation as you release.

Adjusting the amount of pitch and direction of the pitches in your grip, can get the ball to roll out of your hand differently. If you can communicate your grip details (spans, pitches, grips/slug, all the details), it will tell me a lot.

Very little axis rotation usually causes the ball to read the lane fairly quickly. Not a bad thing if lanes are slick. What are you averaging? What kind of equipment have you tried? What style of finger grips do you use? Are you bowling on a lot of oil?

Where does the flare of the ball go after the first rotation? What kind of layouts have you tried? Are the pin positions of your equipment near your fingers (above or below)? are the Center of Gravity markers or Mass Bias locater pins close to your grip or shifted (how far) away?

You could have a little full roller in your delivery, or your Walter Ray Williams up the back of the ball. Your grip could be forcing you to roll the ball as you do, or you may be fighting a short or odd combination of pitches.

Hard to suggest layouts without knowing what you have, how you roll, and what might be causing it. Let me know as much as you can and with more to work with, we can address your thumb (hole) thumping.

My assumption always is your thumb is fully inserted in the ball, finger tips to the first crease. Minimal grip pressure. Thanks for the question. I am looking forward to your response.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: well i was rescently injurred and am currently throwing 13 lb equipment but i always tracked relatively close to the finger and thumb a least the first rotation or to, then moves left. i have tried many lay outs. typically stacked above the ring with 3" pins or stacked below the ring with short pins. or slightly kicked out a little out side the ring finger. i have all kinds of bowling balls but am currently rolling a jolt solid, spitfire, and temper. my span is 3 7/8 and 3 15/16  my thumb pitches are currently 3/16 <--   and about 1/8 forward, or under. have fooled around with the reverse not so much with the side. tried right pitche really hurt my thumb..   prefer vise grips hate turbo. usually use thumb sleeves more rescently experimenting with slugs. any more help would be great i also work partime in a pro shop so i have access to all the tools and equipment necessary to make changes on a regular basis.. thanks for the first response looking for ward to the next..

Answer
Aarik,
Pin location influences your track.  If the pin is placed beyond the halfway point between your track and axis, placement starts to effect the track, pulling the track towards the pin (onto your fingers).

Given your PAP, if your pin is above your ring finger, it's probably 5 to 5 1/2 inches (or more) from your axis, but only 2 or 2 1/2 inches from your track (first rotation). Do you always use longer Pin to PAP placements in your layouts?

What are the pitches for your fingers?

Your left lateral in the thumb keeps you more up the back of the ball.

Slower ball speed with cg in the grip and a bigger pin ball with the pin 4 inches from your PAP, and pin higher above the fingers, maybe 2 inches from your vertical axis line, will help the track problem but probably create a stronger reaction (don't know the lane conditions, or your rev rate) than what your throwing now.