AboutJoe McSorley Expertise I can answer questions dealing with Taoist philosophy and Zen and not the historicity and religion of Buddhism and its different schools. I studied under Dr. Richard DeMartino and Masao Abe of the Kyoto School of Zen.
Question Hi Joe,
I know the Tao Te Ching and the Chuang Tzu are the most important Tao writings but I am wondering about the value of the following and if any cautions are needed:
Lieh Tzu
Hua Hu Ching
Wen Tzu
Sun Tzu
Thanks
Answer Hello Garrett,
Yes, there is value in reading these authors/writings but it is really contingent on what you bring to it. There is a lot of argument over the authenticity of the Hua Hu Ching because it was considered a contrived article written around 300 CE, centuries after Lao Tzu’s death and written for the purpose of the Buddhist/Taoist arguments of the day. Regardless, there is good sound Taoist philosophy in it along with the questionable history of Lao Tzu and other problems. So is there some good, yes, but it can’t be taken as all good.
Lieh Tzu’s version of inaction is degenerated into just ‘no action’ as opposed to spontaneous action that is the root of no personal action but emanating from the source. He is severely criticized for this viewpoint and it is a critique I share. The last original work of Lieh tzu was lost in the second century BCE so what goes for his writings today are clearly not his. A lot of the writings are just lifted from Chuang tzu and the chapter of Yang Chu goes directly in conflict with Taoist harmony of ‘having no desire’ by supporting great hedonism. However, that being said you have a paragraph like this in it:
“On his journey to Wei, the Master Lieh Tzu took a meal by the roadside. His followers espied an old skull, and pulled aside the undergrowth to show it to him. Turning to his disciple Po Fêng, the Master said: 'That skull and I both know that there is no such thing as absolute life or death.
'If we regard ourselves as passing along the road of evolution, then I am alive and he is dead. But looked at from the standpoint of the Absolute, since there is no such principle as life in itself, it follows that there can be no such thing as death.'
This knowledge is better than all your methods of prolonging life, a more potent source of happiness than any other.”
This is fairly sound Taoist philosophy in itself but you have to know that coming into the reading.
A lot of people find the Wen Tzu as a great bridging element between the different masters and I understand that Thomas Cleary’s translation is good but I myself have not read it. Sun Tzu, though employing Taoist principals, is not so interested in a harmonious awakening but in teaching the art of war. I use Sun Tzu in my martial arts instruction but it is more about the fighting and strategy than about Taoism in and of itself. Much like Miyamoto Musashi’s “Book of Five Rings” is Zen inspired/influenced but not a book teaching Zen.
So it really depends on what you are bringing to the table here and how well you understand the Tao Te Ching and the Inner Chapters as to what you will get out of this. I am not trying to be vague in this answer; it’s just not a black and white picture here.
I hope this has helped you. Take care,
Joe
