Expert: Joe McSorley - 5/12/2004

Question
Hello sir.  I appreciate your time and information.  I've begun zen practice under a roshi in the salt lake city area.  He mentions sometimes to become the non seeking/non grasping mind during meditation.  I was wondering if there was a translation of non seeker, to whatever it's original context or language might be (japanese i think.  Is there such a word in zen? Or is this just an english term.

Thank you very much,

Brian Brown

Answer
Hi Brian,
   Sorry for the delay in getting back to you.  I do not speak Japanese but the expressions you use are commonly used in Zen parlance.  An expression that Masao Abe Sensei uses is ‘that which is being sought is that which is doing the seeking'.  I don't know of a specific Japanese phrase for non-seeker.  Generally the term used is ‘no-mind' (mushin/munen/we-hsin) in Japanese, or to use Hisamatsu's words ‘meditation mind and body fallen off'.  Here he doesn't even leave room for a non-seeking, non-grasping mind but cuts through that too.  It is very hard to articulate true Zen and we often get tangled in the words.  In the classic Zen story of the mirror and stand where one monk says to ‘ever polish it to keep it clear of dust' and then Hui-neng says “ originally no mirror, no stand' we see this idea of no-mind or mind and body fallen off. Originally there is no mind to grasp or seek.  In Shibayama's words it was ‘ever strive to keep the mirror clean and the smash the mirror.”  So there are many articulations of no-mind or no-self and non-seeker but you must realize that there is no substance to the non-seeking and non-grasping mind too, it is like the polished mirror and must be smashed.
  If you are able to locate Urrs App on the web he is probably one of the most brilliant Buddhist scholars in the world and I am sure he can help you with specific phrases.  He speaks about 6 languages fluently including Japanese and English.  I know that he had a website devoted to Zen translations but I don't know where it is.  Perhaps you can find it on google.  Take care,
        Joe