Expert: D. Norkus - 9/16/2008

Question
QUESTION: Hello:
  I am in the process of choosing between 2 flight schools and would like your opinion.  

The first school is ATP, which has a branch in Houston.  ATP does most of it’s flight training in twin engine aircraft, which means that students and instructors there get to log hundreds of hours of multi-engine time.  

The second flight school is a local flight school which does it’s training in single engine aircraft.  However this school is cheaper then ATP.  

Do you think that ATP is a better choice even if it cost   more because of all the multi engine time students/instructors can build?  How important do airlines consider multi engine time?

Thanks


ANSWER: Alex

I have no personal experience with ATP, but I do know some pilots who have done their career pilot program and were quite pleased with their experience and training. Of course this was almost 3 years ago (2005) when airline hiring was brisk, so both landed jobs straight away which may not be the case now with that "guaranteed interview"they promise. Two pilots I worked are now mentors on the ATP Flight School message boards at this site: http://www.beanairlinepilot.com/ You can ask questions of the ATP Career Track grads there and I recommend you do so.

I also know an aspiring pilot that did not do well in their Career Track program and left after 30 hours. I was told the reason why was the CFIs at that location (Arizona) were not really "teachers" but low time pilots flight instructors that taught you to mimick them as a way of learning and not really imparting knowledge to their students. If you want to talk to the student pilot personally, email me at pilotcareer at gmail dot com and I will pass along a contact.

On a financial note:
True, quality flight time (multi, night & instrument) is what the airlines are looking for but you don't have to go into serious debt to try and fly everything in a twin. Worry about meeting the minimum requirements. Anything else is gravy. Only a few years ago programs like ATP were promising guaranteed regional airline interviews to their graduates. That alone was reason enough to put your money into such a program: Get hired at less than normal experience minimums, start building airline seniority and flight time sooner. Summer 2008? Perhaps not so much. Since virtually no airline is hiring, where are these $60K flight program grads going? I can't answer that. All I know is that they are no longer coming to my airline as we are not hiring. That is also the case elsewhere. In fact, several are furloughing pilots. Currently, the market is flooded with pilots looking for jobs.

Since the pilot job market is in such a slump right now, IMO there is no hurry to get your training done as virtually no one is hiring. I would strongly suggest that you consider the less costly option. While I used to suggest otherwise, considering the current situation these days, you will probably be thankful to get your training done as cheaply as possible when starting pay for regional pilots is about $23K.

However, IF you are willing to pay the money for the program and get  your "guaranteed interview" later on when hiring resumes, while working as an ATP instructor in the iterim, you will surely be a very qualified pilot candidate. The question is: what can you afford to do financially?  IMO, if such flight training would be a financial burden I would go with the less expensive route. Luckily I was able to do exactly that during my training and was thankful I had no outstanding training loans to pay off starting out on new hire/<5 yr F/O pay. After 10 years in the career I know an RJ captain that still has $45K in flight training loans to pay off and that is not an enviable position.

I wish I could give you a hard, quick answer but obviously it is much more complicated as I don't know your financial situation. Yet even if I did, such a decision is a very personal one as it may push your budget to the limit. I hope this has given you something to consider though.

Good Luck,
Dottie

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Hello:
   I quick follow up question.  Do airlines differentiate between multi engine PIC time multi engine time logged while instructing?  What is the difference between the two?  If airlines want multi engine PIC time and don't care much about multi engine time while instructing, is ATP really worth it?

Answer
Alex

Not being part of the hiring board, I cannot say for certain but it seems to me they do not differentiate much between ME PIC or ME as PIC CFI. The difference is that as a ME CFI your student will do most of the flying versus you.

When I was asked to interview, it was based on a resume. Only after I filled out an application did the airline see what the actual breakdown of my times was. (I had no CFI time at all with 1,100 & 115ME).

Of course, a person on the hiring board may chose to weight your ME time more heavily as it was all flown by you, versus a student, but on the other hand having that ME CFI is also a way to get your resume to score points. It is really up to the interview team- and they are all different.

The big plus of ATP (or any other school with twins) is that it is a route to get that ME time. Paying for it on your own is usually very cost prohibitive at $130+/hr. This is why many go the CFI route: so they can get paid to log ME time.

In my situation, I did not have a CFI so I did a Cockpit Resource Management / Safety Pilot program in a twin to build my hours. It was much cheaper than doing it all on my own. That may be another opportunity for you as well. Mine was offered via a flight school with  actual airline based procedures, call outs & checklists. Of course, you can also fly a twin with a safety pilot pal on your own but I don't think you'd get the same result learning wise even if you got the same flight time on your own.

Dot