Expert: Sal - 9/13/2004

Question
Hi Sal,

I have two questions for you.  How did the rumour that there was a female pope by the name of Joan ever come into existence?  Was Avignon ever the valid seat of the papacy or was it always Rome?  I assume that all our popes going back to St. Peter were based in Rome, but I'm not positive this is correct.

Thanks!

Answer
Dear Les:

Great to hear from you my friend. You always ask such interesting questions. Thanks for this opportunity to help.

The fable of “Pope” Joan seems to have first appeared in the mid 13th century. It is unknown who first began this fairytale. There are various accounts of the supposed reign of Joan. One account goes like this she reigned for 2 years around the year 1100 AD. She was an intelligent woman. She dressed as a man to gain approval. She first became a notary to the Curia then she became a Cardinal, and finally was elected pope. Her lie was exposed when she gave birth to a son. A mob upon learning that she was a woman stoned her to death. She is not actually named in this account.

Another account is that she was Pope at a much earlier time. She supposedly was Pope from 855-857 AD. This account goes that after the death of Pope Leo IV in 855 a man by the name John of Mainz became Pope. This is the first account to use the proper name “Joan” for the popess. She is said to have been a science teacher dressed as a man. She was well respected and was elected Pope. She supposedly died giving birth to a son while in procession from St. Peter's Basilica to the Basilica of St. John Lateran.

A third account is the same as the previous account above except that it claims that “Pope” Joan did not die in childbirth, but rather she was put in prison and later died there. Her son became a Bishop.

A variation account says that “Pope” Joan gave birth to a girl named Agnes in some accounts and Gilberta in others.

Amazingly many believed some form of this fable. This popess is a pure figment of some anti-Catholic imagination. Even Protestant historians label “Pope” Joan a hoax. Anti-Catholics still use this fake story to attack the Church and the faith of Catholics.

There are many very strong proofs that this “Pope” Joan never existed. Extremely important evidence is that NOT ONE historical source written around the time of Joan's supposed reign knows anything of her! She is not mentioned until the mid 13th century. It is incredible that if such a Pope existed that NOT ONE contemporary historian would have recorded it! Further we find no missing popes in the line of Popes from St. Peter. If she reigned from 855-857 as some claimed she would have followed Pope Leo IV who died July 17, 855. However, history names Pope Benedict III as his immediate successor. No place for “Pope” Joan there. If she reigned around 1100 AD she would again have no place among the list of Popes. Pope Victor III is known to have died in 1087. He was succeeded by Urban II (1088-1099). The next  Pope was Paschal II (1099-1110). So we see that there is just no place for this “Pope” Joan.

All Popes did not always live in Rome; however, they we all Bishop of Rome. The Avignon papacy was brought about when Rome became too dangerous for the Pope. There were armed anti-Catholic/anti-Papal gangs ruling Rome. These gangs destroyed the Basilica of St. John Lateran. The Pope was advised to leave Rome for his own safety. In 1308 began what some refer to as “the Babylonian Captivity” of the Papacy. The Avignon Popes were:
1)   Clement V (1305-1314)
2)   John XXII (1316-1334)
3)   Benedict XII (1334-1342)
4)   Clement VI (1342-1352)
5)   Innocent VI (1352-1362)
6)   Urban V (1362-1370)
7)   Gregory XI (1370-1378)

While it is a fact that Pope Clement V was in danger in Rome it is also a fact that once the danger passed the Popes remained in Avignon. They should have returned to Rome much sooner than they did. The Popes stayed in Avignon because they were under the power of the government there for one reason. They also were living fairly well for another reason. It was the great saint, Catherine of Siena that persuaded Pope Gregory XI that for the betterment of the Church he needed to return to Rome which he then did do. The “Babylonian Captivity” of the papacy ended in 1378.

I pray that this was helpful to you, Les. If I can be of further help please do not hesitate to ask.

God Bless You,
Sal