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Chimney & Fireplaces/Fireplace and flue safety

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Expert: - 10/3/2008


Question

fireplace interior
My elderly mother has a fireplace she uses to heat a family room that is about 25-30 years old.  It is a triple wall metal flue, apparently a one-piece unit with the fireplace.  I recently had it cleaned and inspected by a chimney professional.  He recommended that we no longer use the fireplace, mostly based on its age; he also indicated that his reservations were based on “what he couldn’t see” that might be unsafe.  I think he was referring to the fact that the flue is encased in framing outside the house, and he could only see from the inside of the innermost pipe, which seemed to be okay.  He was not able to see the condition of the two outer pipes.

It was also looked at by another person, a general contractor, who said we should put a new layer of firebrick on the bottom of the fireplace, and a new screen in front; but other than that his opinion was that the fireplace was safe, based on his looking at the firebox and its attachment to the flue, and based on his looking at the inside of the flue both from top and bottom.  

I’ve attached a couple pictures, which may or may not be helpful.  Question is: if the innermost tube of a triple wall flue is solid and clean, can we assume the other two tubes are okay?  Part of my concern is that the professional chimney person also offered to sell us a new fireplace, or if we wanted a cheaper option, he could install a gas log.  Your opinion and thoughts are appreciated.  

Answer
Rich,

Your factory built fireplace and chimney system are tested and listed as a complete system for safety. The Underwriters Laboratories, UL test that was performed was #UL-127. Your fireplace would appear to be either a "Superior" or "Majestic" system. You can not assume that anything you cant see is okay. Nor can anyone simply put firebrick in the bottom or back. In some regards, you received sound advice from your chimney pro as these units only have a life expectancy of 25 years or so and you are there. I'm certainly not predicting disaster, but I would put removal and replacement on my short list. Please feel free to use the links at the bottom of my home page at www.brooks-hearth.com and find an inspector that can perform a more detailed NFPA-211 level II inspection of you system. With all this said, your system may be okay, but you will need to open up some access for a real inspector of fireplaces top gain visual access. Best of luck to you.
    Questioner's Rating
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    Commentthank you for a clean, lucid, and prompt reply. You were very helpful; I'll get another professional inspection that goes into more depth--sounds like it will be worth the cost to know for sure one way or another. THanks again. RHayton


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Randy Brooks

Expertise

Inspection of Masonry, Pre-cast Tilt-up, and Factory Built Fireplaces as well as Free Standing & Insert, Gas, and Wood Appliances. We also provide Hearth Fire Loss Investigations, Litigation Support, Consulting Services, Flue Sweeping, Installation and Repair. Additionally, I’ve been a chimney sweep for 23 years, service and install hearth appliances as well as being recognized by the Superior Court of California as an expert witness.

Experience

Brooks Chimney Sweeping Since 1989 Ojai, CA Owner / President www.brooks-hearth.com

Organizations
NCSG, MEMBER,(National Chimney Sweep Guild), Member since 1990, Board of Directors representing Region 6, (CA, NV, AZ, UT, OR, WA, ID, WY, MT, AK and HI,) 2004-2011, ethics committee chair, 2004-2005, executive committee member, Vice President, 2006-2008, President, 2008-2011. CSIA, BOD (Chimney Safety Institute of America,) Board of Directors, ethics committee chair, 2004-2005, executive committee member, Secretary, 2005-2006, Vice President, 2006-2008, President, 2008-2011. HPBA, MEMBER, (Hearth, Patio, & BBQ Association,) since 2002. NFPA Member, (National Fire Protection Association) Since 2009. Technical Committee member for the 211 Standard.

Education/Credentials
California State Licensed Contractor, C61-D34, #750710. http://www2.cslb.ca.gov C.S.I.A., (Chimney Safety Institute of America,) Certified Chimney Sweep, #2580. Held since 1990 re-certified in ‘93, ‘96, ‘99, ‘02, ‘05, '08,'11. http://www.csia.org F.I.R.E. (Fireplace Investigation, Research & Education Service,) Certified Inspector, #FP-006. Held since 2000, re-certified in ’03, ‘06. http://www.f-i-r-e-service.com Fireplace Investigation, Research & Education Service,) Advance Expert Consulting & Witness, certificate, ’05 N.F.I. (National Fireplace Institute,) Certified Gas & Wood-Burning Specialist, #133851. Held since 2002, re-certified in '05,‘08. http://nficertified.org

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