Expert: Brenda Martin - 9/22/2006

Question
How do we determine the age of a writing?  For instance Matthew was 8 years after Christ's ascension...we dont use science to date it right?

And specifically how did you come up with "8."  I guess you might have to go through source "Q" and all that to tell me, but if it can be a short explanation Im find with that.

And have you read the book by Borg...Meeting Jesus Again For The First Time?  If so did you see any of the historical references as invalid?  

Answer
Hi there Jeff, you asked--"HOW DO WE DETERMINE THE AGE OF A WRITING?"

Let’s take the book of psalms as an example,

The Writers:-- David and others
Writing Completed: c. 460 B.C.E

The book of Psalms is the Bible’s largest single book. As evidenced by Psalms 90, 126, and 137, it was long in the writing, at least from the time Moses wrote (1513-1473 B.C.E.) until after the restoration from Babylon and probably Ezra’s day (537–c. 460 B.C.E.). Thus, the writing is seen to span approximately a thousand years.

Basically the contents determine when it was written.

HOW DID YOU COME UP WITH "8."

Matthew wrote his account in Palestine. The exact year is not known, but subscriptions at the end of some manuscripts (all later than the tenth century C.E.) say that it was 41 C.E.  

This does not conflict with the internal evidence, since the account ends with Jesus’ commissioning of disciple makers in 33 C.E. and says nothing about Jerusalem’s destruction at Roman hands in 70 C.E.

AND HAVE YOU READ THE BOOK BY BORG...MEETING JESUS AGAIN FOR THE FIRST TIME

No never heard of it

HOW FAR BETWEEN WERE THE GOSPELS MADE FROM EACH OTHER?

The books of the Christian Greek Scriptures, listed according to the approximate year (C.E.) written, are as follows:-

MATTHEW, 41C.E.
-------------
1 and 2 Thessalonians, 50 and 51
Galatians, 50-52
1 and 2 Corinthians, 55
Romans, 56
LUKE, 56-58 C.E.
------------------
Ephesians, Colossians, Philemon, Philippians, 60-61
Hebrews, Acts, 61
James, before 62
MARK, 60-65 C.E.
--------------
1 Timothy, Titus, 61-64
1 Peter, 62-64
2 Peter, 64
2 Timothy, Jude, 65
Revelation, 96
JOHN and 1, 2, 3 John, 98.c.e.
---------

This period of less than 60 years is quite a contrast with the nearly 11 centuries taken to complete the Hebrew Scriptures.

SOME SAY THE QURAN IS PERFECTLY PRESERVED WHILE THE BIBLE IS NOT

These people are misinformed--

The Bible is the oldest book on earth, its origins stretching back nearly 6,000 years. No other holy book has had so universal a distribution, nor does any have origins even half as old. The Koran of Mohammedanism is less than 1,400 years old. Buddha and Confucius lived about 2,500 years ago, and their writings date from that time. The Scriptures of Shinto were composed in their present form no more than 1,200 years ago. The Book of Mormon is only 140 years old. None of these holy books can accurately trace human history back through 6,000 years, as does the Bible.

How can we be sure the Bible has not been changed?

“In the number of ancient MSS. [manuscripts] attesting a writing, and in the number of years that had elapsed between the original and the attesting MSS., the Bible enjoys a decided advantage over classical writings [those of Homer, Plato, and others]. . . . Altogether classical MSS. are but a handful compared with Biblical. No ancient book is so well attested as the Bible.”—The Bible From the Beginning (New York, 1929), P. Marion Simms, pp. 74, 76.

In the introduction to his seven volumes on The Chester Beatty Biblical Papyri, Sir Frederic Kenyon wrote: “The first and most important conclusion derived from the examination of them [the papyri] is the satisfactory one that they confirm the essential soundness of the existing texts. No striking or fundamental variation is shown either in the Old or the New Testament. There are no important omissions or additions of passages, and no variations which affect vital facts or doctrines. The variations of text affect minor matters, such as the order of words or the precise words used . . . But their essential importance is their confirmation, by evidence of an earlier date than was hitherto available, of the integrity of our existing texts.”—(London, 1933), p. 15.

RELIGIONS HISTORIES (ISLAM'S WELL DOCUMENTED, CHRISTIANITY IS NOT)

Nonsense, The Bible itself is the principal evidence that Jesus Christ is a historical person. The record in the Gospels is not a vague narrative of events at some unspecified time and in an unnamed location. It clearly states time and place in great detail.

Was Jesus merely a prophet whose authority was similar to that of Moses, Buddha, Muhammad, and other religious leaders?

Jesus himself taught that he was the unique Son of God (John 10:36; Matt. 16:15-17), the foretold Messiah (Mark 14:61, 62), that he had a prehuman existence in heaven (John 6:38; 8:23, 58), that he would be put to death and then would be raised to life on the third day and would thereafter return to the heavens. (Matt. 16:21; John 14:2, 3) Were these claims true, and was he thus really different from all other true prophets of God and in sharp contrast to all self-styled religious leaders? The truth of the matter would be evident on the third day from his death. Did God then resurrect him from the dead, thus confirming that Jesus Christ had spoken the truth and was indeed God’s unique Son? (Rom. 1:3, 4)

Over 500 witnesses actually saw Jesus alive following his resurrection, and his faithful apostles were eyewitnesses as he began his ascent back to heaven and then disappeared from their view in a cloud. (1 Cor. 15:3-8; Acts 1:2, 3, 9) So thoroughly were they convinced that he had been raised from the dead that many of them risked their lives to tell others about it.—Acts 4:18-33.

Here is where the 2 diverged—--Abraham had 2 sons, Isaac and Ishmael, God chose Isaac to be the ancestor of Jesus (the founder of Christianity) Ishmael and his mother were sent packing into the wilderness and the Muslims believe they are descendants of Ishmael.

The holy book of the Moslems, the Qur’an, refers to Ishmael in its Sura (section) 19, verses 54 and 55, saying: “Also mention in the Book the story of Ismâ'îl: He was strictly true to what he promised, and he was an apostle and a prophet. . . . He was most acceptable in the sight of his Lord.” Qur’an translator A. Yusuf Ali commented concerning Abraham’s sons, Ishmael and Isaac: “The younger son’s progeny developed the Faith of Israel and that of Christ; the elder son’s progeny perfected the more universal Faith of Islam, the Faith of Abraham the True. . . . in the universality of Islam all nations are to be blessed.”

However as the Bible clearly shows, through Abraham’s son Isaac came the true “seed” of blessing, Jesus Christ not Ishmael.

WHAT WERE REASONS FOR THESE SUPPOSED FALLACIES OF THE BIBLE AND CHRISTIANITY

Not sure what you are refering to, if you explain, I will be happy to answer.


All the best
Brenda