AboutCarl Fuglein Expertise I can answer questions from teens & young adults concerning their faith walk and on social issues which affect their lives. I can answer questions on sex, homosexuality, and drugs and anything else that might be troubling you. After 30 years in youth ministry, nothing shocks me, and I promise to give straight answers to any and all questions. I can also answer questions from youth workers on problems they`re having with programming or with their groups.
Experience I have been involved in youth and young adult ministries as a volunteer for 30 years. I am currently a volunteer youth minister in a large city UM church - our youth group has about 75 members.
Organizations United Methodist Church, Chrysalis, Walk to Emmaus
Awards and Honors Certified lay speaker for UM Church
Question Hi there, i've been with my girlfriend for more then 2 years now and we have been engaging with mutual masturbation.
As both of us come to know the Lord more, we've been struggling with that issue. i need some help regarding mutual masturbation in terms of the Lord's view. Thanks a lot.
Answer Hi teenager!
Well, my first inclination is to tell you that if you're worried about committing a sin or wondering whether or not something IS a sin, it probably is. I'm happy that you are at least struggling with the issue.
Virtually all youth ministers including myself would say that you've crossed A line, if not THE line with regards to sex. I get questions similar to yours all the time and I have written an essay about "How Far is TOO far". Although mutual masturbation (by mutual, I'm assuming that you do each other rather than do yourself in the company of the other), masturbation itself has issues as well - I've also included an essay I've written about masturbation.
Bottom line is that YOU are the ones who have to make the decision as to whether or not your actions are sinful - my opinion doesn't really count that much. I think you ARE sinning, but that's not really what you asked me. Please take the time to read ALL of the two essays, and have your girlfriend read them with you (at the same time would be good - you can and should discuss them). I realize that they are long, but the issues you bring up are really complicated.
And finally, please take the time to rate my answer - feedback is very important to me I strive to make all my answers understandable for teens, so please let me know if you need clarification of anything.
Blessings,
carl
Essays follow:
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How Far is Too Far?
An essay by Carl Fuglein
God gave us sex. He intended it to be used for creating children. See the following Bible references:
(Gen 2:21-23 NIV)
So the LORD God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man's ribs and closed up the place with flesh. Then the LORD God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man. The man said, "This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called 'woman, ' for she was taken out of man." For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one flesh.
Genesis 3:16 (NIV)
To the woman he said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
An interpretation of 3:16 would indicate that sexual desire or affection is an okay thing, within marriage, because God said so.
Gen 4:1 Then Adam had sexual intercourse with Eve his wife, and she conceived and gave birth to a son, Cain (meaning "I have created"). For, as she said, "With God's help, I have created a man!"
Exodus 20:14 (NIV)
"You shall not commit adultery.”
Sexual relations before marriage is a sin. This is perfectly clear, one of the 10 commandments,
Exodus 20:17 (NIV)
"You shall not covet your neighbor's house. You shall not covet your neighbor's wife, or his manservant or maidservant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor."
Not only is adultery a sin, but even "thinking" about it is a sin (verse 17 – covet means want or desire).
These references are pretty clear, a strict Biblical stance. What is not clear is simply this: "What constitutes sex?" This is the actual question that you are asking when you ask “How far is too far?” There are many reasons why you may be asking this question. One is that you're looking for someone to give you a specific limit. Two, you're looking for permission to do certain "things" without feeling guilt. Third, you really don’t know what, in God's eyes, constitutes sex. Look up these words in the dictionary: sex; sexual intercourse; coitus. Still not very clear, is it. In my dictionary, sexual intercourse has two definitions - one is coitus, the other is "sexual union involving genital contact, but without penile penetration". But human sexuality is not just physical. It's an intellectual, social, ethical and spiritual act with social consequences, and it’s difficult to define.
So, I ask again, what sexual activity is a sin and what is not? Before I try to answer that, let me talk to you about roller coasters. I hope you ride roller coasters, because it will be easier for you to understand what I'm saying. I know you're asking, what does this have to do with sex? Bear with me, I'll make the connection.
Do you remember the first time you rode a roller coaster? What emotions went through your mind? Fear and excitement were the emotions I experienced. You got into the car, and your heart started pumping faster and faster. You went up the first hill, and you got even more excited, and more scared. Maybe you screamed "let me get off" because you lost your nerve. But, too late, you're on the road - you can't get off. You hit the top of the first hill, and you're thinking, "oh I'm gonna die". Then you rush down that first hill and think, "Wow, what a rush, that wasn't so bad, in fact it was really fun." And there you go, up and down all the hills, and when you're through, you want to find a bigger, faster, scarier roller coaster, maybe one that turns you upside down. And, if you're like me, you just can't stop riding roller coasters. You figure out that you're NOT going to die, and that you like the feeling of exhilaration it gives you. And you will find that the first, roller coaster won't produce the same feeling once you've gotten on one bigger and faster. (As a side note - this is a proven fact. The first Space Shuttle in 1981 had two people on board - John Young and Bob Crippen. Young had been in space before - he had flown on an earlier Apollo flight into space. Crippen never had flown into space before. Right before lift off, Young's heart rate was about 90, Crippen's was 120+)
So, what does this have to do with sex? Keep reading.
The feeling you get - excitement and fear, is caused by adrenaline, a hormone. Other hormones that affect your body during sexual arousal are every bit as powerful in making you excited. Some of the feelings that you experience on a roller coaster, you will experience during sex. You'll experience other feelings, too, that are even more powerful. The addiction you might get for roller coasters (i.e., wanting bigger, higher, faster, scarier), is similar to an addiction to sex, i.e., wanting more and more and more out of a physical relationship, and just like you have to ride a bigger rollercoaster to get the same adrenaline rush as you did before, you may have to get more or “different” sex to get the same rush. And if you ride a coaster once, you'll ride it again, and again, and again. I'm 58 - I STILL love roller coasters, and I'm STILL looking for bigger and better coasters. But there’s another factor to sex that doesn’t happen with roller coasters – when you have sex, you give away some of your emotions, some of your heart, and some of your purity that God gave you. There’s no roller coaster that I’m emotionally involved with.
Human sexuality is complex. Women need a reason to have sex. Men need a place. Women are sexually stimulated by receiving flowers from their boyfriends. Men are sexually stimulated merely by looking at their girlfriends without ever coming in contact with them. So, should you never look at your girlfriend or give her flowers? It's all part of the human sexuality "dance" leading to sexual union. Peacocks strut their feathers, humans do all sorts of strange things prior to having sex. When you're older and in a committed marriage relationship, merely "talking" and "cuddling" can constitute sex or foreplay. The answer, I think, is where do you put the "line" and I think that the "line" may be in different places for different people.
So, we come back to the question again, what is sex? A physical relationship might go like this:
1. You see a pretty girl. She smiles at you.
2. You talk to her. She talks to you. You both laugh.
3. She tells a friend to tell a friend to tell you that she LIKES you.
4. You tell a friend to tell a friend to tell her that you LIKE HER BACK.
5. You talk some more.
6. You go to the library to "study".
7. On the way home, you hold hands.
8. You go out on your first "date".
9. You hold hands, and at the door when you drop her off, you give her a hug, and maybe even kiss her, once, quickly.
10. You go out again, and maybe kiss her twice or nibble on her ear.
11. After you've been going out for a while, you experiment, and you French kiss.
12. Wow, that was fun, what's next? Lying down on a couch perhaps, but "just kissing".
13. While still fully clothed, but lying on a bed, you touch her and she touches you, use your imagination as to where.
14. Step 14 is the same as 13, only with buttons unbuttoned and zippers unzipped.
15. Ditto, only maybe without SOME clothes
16. Ditto again, only with NO clothes.
17. Mutual masturbation. (this might start occurring in step 13)
18. Oral sex. (Could happen as early as 15)
19. Protected sexual intercourse.
20. Unprotected sexual intercourse.
Question - at which step above do you commit a sin? What is the definition of sex? Where does being friends end and “sex” begin? The difference between 1 and 2 is tiny. The difference between 9 and 10 is tiny. The difference between 17 and 18 is tiny. The difference between 1 and 20 is HUGE. Consider the step that YOU think is a sin, and your girlfriend agrees; - pretend that step is a cliff. If you go that far, you're going to fall off the cliff - and every step after that one will be tiny, but hey, it doesn't matter, because you already fell off the cliff. Once you've decided where that cliff is, just like in real life if you were to walk to the edge of the Grand Canyon, take at LEAST two steps back, just in case, and say, "Okay, I feel comfortable looking at the Grand Canyon from here, two steps back, but if I get closer, the excitement of the view is not worth the fear and or guilt of getting too close to the edge. Remember the roller coaster. You get on the first hill and you want to get off, but it's too late - you're going to go down that first hill whether you want to or not. For most people, getting on that roller coaster is step 11 or 12. Once you get on, you have a really difficult time stopping that roller coaster car - once you're on, you're on.
Where should you place your cliff? That's pretty much up to you based on your experience and your morals. 90+% of adults, if they're honest, will tell you that sex is downright fun, and it is. But there is a LOT more to sex than just the physical part. Sex inside marriage is guilt free. Outside marriage, it's not - it's guilt laden. Trust me when I tell you that the excitement is NOT worth the guilt, much less the possibility of a sexually transmitted disease or pregnancy. In addition to STDs and pregnancy, there are an awful lot of emotions that come into play; some of which you won't understand until you're an adult. Remember that everything you do, along with everyone you do it with, will be in your mind on your wedding night. If you truly love your bride, wouldn't you want to wait to give it all to her instead of only part of you? Going all the way will give you emotional baggage that will be extremely hard to empty when you get married, especially if one partner is a virgin, and the other isn't.
So, where do you put the cliff? We've already talked about what the Bible says. The Bible does not directly mention French kissing; it doesn't mention oral sex. But despite what President Clinton said, oral sex IS very much "sex". ANY genital contact, even with clothes on, in MY opinion, is sex. Most clinical definitions of sex are just that – ANY genital contact constitutes sex. In my opinion, French kissing might fall into that category for some, too. If you're wondering whether or not it's sex, regardless of whether you're right or wrong, there will always be that doubt in your mind. Some people will decide that if you can’t do something with your mother, you can’t do it with a girlfriend – you might kiss your mom on the lips, but you certainly wouldn’t French kiss her.
What do I base my opinions on from a Biblical point of view? Sex is God's gift to us for the purpose of having children as well as for our enjoyment. Anything that would LEAD to the act of making a baby outside of marriage could be a sin. Let me explain, if a step would prepare your body for the act of intercourse, (specifically, causing the male to have an erection or the female’s vagina to become wet) it probably should be considered a sin. For most people, that point would be step 11, French kissing. For some, it might not happen until step 12 or 13, for others it might start as early as 9 or 10. Once you get to that point, i.e., real sexual arousal, any labels become meaningless and it becomes more and more difficult to stop – remember those raging hormones.
So, you and your girlfriend should talk about this, and set your own limits. You asked my opinion: step 10 is okay, step 11 may not be, and 12 is definitely bordering on risky behavior.
There are also other things to worry about, too. The HIV virus has been found in saliva. That means French kissing someone who has HIV COULD pass it on to you. It’s unlikely, but if you don’t know who your partner has been with (and if it’s more than you, you also have to take into consideration who the other guy is and how many girls he's been with, etc, etc.)
STD's (sexually transmitted disease) can be transmitted by oral sex. Some STD’s are painful, some can be deadly. Regardless, you don’t want them. And many have no cure. HIV most definitely would be passed on during oral sex. And then if you DO get infected with an STD, out of respect for others, you should never have sex again to keep from infecting them. A scary fact is this: if you have sex with someone who has had multiple partners, it is almost statistically impossible for you to NOT get an STD. Another fact is interesting – ALL STDs could be entirely eliminated, if an entire generation lost their virginity only with a virgin – think about it.
Pregnancy, although highly unlikely at step 13, can actually occur then - penile penetration is NOT necessary to make a baby - sperm have a single purpose in mind - to get to an egg, and they CAN get there alive if they are in near proximity to a vagina like they would be in step 15, even with clothes on. The point is that even with protected sex, you can still easily make babies. Condoms are only about 85 - 90% effective. And many STDs are not prevented even with a condom. If you do it once every 3 days with a condom, your girlfriend could potentially get pregnant as many as 15 times in a year. Are you willing to take that risk? A child is yours for life. Are you willing to be responsible for a child for years just to have a few minutes of fun? This is part of the joy of sex – my wife and I knew immediately when she got pregnant, and it was truly a blessing and enhanced the physical act.
Maybe I've answered your question, maybe not, but if I haven't, please ask me some more questions. Talk this over with your girlfriend, and if you're comfortable, with your parents and even his parents. By the way, if your and your girlfriend's cliffs are in two separate spots - you'll have to agree to the less risky step in order to honor the other's wishes. This will become more and more important, even within marriage. The relationship has to be mutual.
And finally, think seriously about this statement: guys will give away love to get sex. Girls will give away sex to get love.
And if you've already gone beyond my suggested cliff, don't despair. There is grace - God loves you and will forgive you. You must try very hard not to go there again.
One way you can figure out if a relationship has gone too far is if sex is he only thing you do. You used to go to the zoo to watch the animals. Now you go to the library to hide in the back stacks and make out. You used to go to the movies to actually watch the movie. Now you go to hold hands, kiss, and more. You used to come over to each other’s houses to play computer games when mom or dad are home. Now you wait until you’re pretty sure you’re alone, and you don’t play computer games, but other kind of games. Trust me, there is so much more to marriage than sex. Sure, sex is great, but being married to your best friend, even without sex, is better.
Finally, consider this. Pledge to not have sex until marriage. Write it down. Sign it. Something like this on an index card:
“On __________, 2006, I made a pledge to myself and before God to not have sex until my wedding night. Here’s my signature to prove it. This card is my wedding gift to you.”
Put that card in your wallet and carry it with you. Let it get crumpled and bent and worn out. And on your wedding night, pull it out of your wallet and hand it to your wife. It’ll be the best present you will ever give her (until you father her child.) Trust me on this.
Here’s some links for you to learn more about sex – remember that some of these are secular sources, don’t forget what the Bible says.
http://www.family.org this is a Christian site. Enter “sex” then hit “search” – several good articles.
http://www.sxetc.org An online ‘zine for teens, by teens, about sex. Excellent resource, but remember it’s secular – remember your Bible. I only recommend this site because it presents a more balanced view. But I disagree with a LOT of what is said here.
http://www.teenwire.com This is a site by Planned Parenthood, a widely recognized expert source on sexual matters, however their goal is planning pregnancy, and they don’t necessarily “push” abstinence as “the” answer, only as “an” answer. Much of this site is written by teens and will give you some insight into what your peers are thinking. You should know that Planned Parenthood also approves of abortion but I do NOT.
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Is Masturbation a sin?
Masturbation is not mentioned specifically in the Bible.
Because of that, we don’t really know whether it is a sin or not. Many people say yes. Many say no. It’s one of those issues that is difficult to determine, and you have to make up your own mind.
Some of the emotions that can along with masturbation ARE sins, e.g., lust (coveting someone other than your husband) which will normally occur when you masturbate. (See Matthew 5:27-28) Masturbation is normally done for selfish pleasure – if all you are focused on is yourself, then how can you be honoring God? God gave us sex for both pleasure (within marriage) and to procreate the race. Masturbation does one, not the other.
But where does lust begin and end? Is masturbation the beginning of lust or does it end lust? Steve Gerali, a nationally known speaker and author, in his book, “The Struggle” (about masturbation mostly from a male perspective) says this:
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“If we’re honest we’d have to agree that the sexual thoughts, desires, arousal and even lust precede the need to masturbate. Once orgasm occurs, all of that is gone. Masturbation is the end of lust, not the beginning of lust. Masturbation isn’t lust nor does it feed lust. It ends lustful episodes. … there are many godly men and women who believe that because masturbation follows the lust and shuts down the process, it becomes the way out that many people pray for. For these people, this deliverance from lust makes masturbation a gift from God.”
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You have to understand that God created sex, and that sex is good. Therefore, how can sexual thoughts necessarily be bad? They’re not. Sexual desire and physical attraction for the opposite sex are not bad, particularly if they’re towards a spouse or future spouse. But if thoughts of sex become all you think about, then those thoughts can be lust and be considered a sin. By the same logic, if all you think about is the next time you can masturbate or the next time you can eat Ben & Jerry’s ice cream or the next time you can play Nintendo, then you may have a problem. You also have to know that masturbation is far from the best sex you’ll ever have – I don’t think it’s what God created sex for. God gave us these crazy desires. Maybe He’d rather us lean on Him for strength to avoid this behavior than to grab a magazine and head for our rooms.
Let’s look at the physiological, spiritual, and emotional consequences of masturbation. Pam Stenzel, a nationally known educator in the area of teenage sexuality, specifically abstinence education, says in her book, “Sex Has a Price Tag,”:
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10 Plus 7 Dangers Of Masturbation
1. Sex happens in the brain first. The arousal response is the most easily trained response in a human being. What we do to prepare the body for sexual response and arousal becomes what we need in order to be aroused. In other words, masturbation trains your body to respond a specific way to specific stimuli.
2. Because of 1, masturbation often becomes addictive.
3. Addictive behaviors are difficult to change.
4. Because of 3. masturbation tends to control the person rather than the person controlling the masturbation. (In other words, it's a habit that's hard to break.)
5. Once the brain has trained a person's sexual response through masturbation or other self-stimulation, the body will continue to require the same activity for sexual response even after a sexual partnership (that is, marriage) has begun.
6. The chemicals released in the brain during sexual stimulation are extremely powerful, and the repeated use of self-stimulation can damage one's ability to respond appropriately to marriage intimacy. (Refer back to 5).
7. It's easier to say no to something before it becomes a habit.
8. Human beings can say no. Masturbation is often encouraged as a way to deal with sexual feelings and drives that cannot be controlled.
9. Contrary to popular belief, the desire to masturbate does not stop after marriage. It is not a cure for temporarily dealing with sexual pressure before marriage.
10. The most common problems for which married men seek counseling today are pornography and masturbation.
11. The same experts who declare that masturbation aren’t addictive, go on to claim that guys and girls who masturbate -are powerless to stop doing so. So which is it?
12. Saying yes to masturbation (sometimes referred to as "having sex with oneself") in order to say no to having sex with someone else, does not make masturbation a good and positive thing. In other words, something that is "less wrong" is not necessarily right. Something that is less dangerous is not necessarily safe. And something that is "less false" is not necessarily true.
13, Masturbation takes the mystery of sex and the wonder of "becoming one flesh" with another person and reduces it to something it was never intended to be - a solo activity consisting of a simple biological arousal/release activity rather than something that embraces body, soul, and spirit.
14. Masturbation will not make your hands fall off, your face turn blue, or your brain insane. But that doesn’t mean you should do it, does it?
15, Hebrews '13;4 says, "Marriage is to be held in honor among all and the marriage bed is to be undefiled, for fornicators and adulterers God will judge." The word fornicators/fornication, pornea, means any sexual behavior, thought, or deed, outside of the sacramental act between a husband and wife. Self-stimulation, or masturbation falls into this category'. It defiles the marriage bed.
16, Cultivating the self discipline that’s required to say no to masturbation now, before becoming one flesh: with a lifelong mate, will develop the strength of character necessary to continue keeping a marriage pure.
17. And one more thing – God forgives freely. Never forget that. At the same time, never use that to justify behavior that goes against God’s desire and will for your life.
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I agree with Pam on every item but 15 – I’m not so sure that God intended for masturbation to fall into the same category as fornicators.
As to Items 1 & 5-6: A sexual addiction counselor, Dr. Douglass Weiss, agrees. In a presentation he describes how sex and the brain interact:
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“In the center of the brain is the medial preoptic nucleus (MPN). In your brain, when you have a sexual release, your brain experiences a release of chemicals called endorphins and encephalins. This is the highest rush in the human body. It is the same area cocaine affects; this is why cocaine is so addicting.
Because you get the highest reward for this behavior, you want to do it again. Now, here's where it's unique. When you get the reward, whatever you're looking at—it doesn't have to be real—whatever you're looking at [at sexual release] you are bonding to whatever that [object] is. So, if you have a sexual fantasy, you'll start bonding to a fantasy world.
God designed it so that you would bond with one person. [To men:] In a very short period of time, no matter what your wife looks like, you bond to her. She becomes your desire. And when you think about intimacy and sexuality, you think about her. If you [masturbate] and you reward yourself for going to fantasy world, then the fantasy is going to be what you desire. You're going to see women as objects, not people. That's not God's design. God wants you to see someone as His child. As a person.
Your brain doesn't know the difference, between this [object] being appropriate or inappropriate. It just knows it got the rewards. Now, if it gets good stuff [chemical rewards] attached to bad things, what will it want to do? Bad things. [Protect] your brain. This is a holy place. If you start [masturbating] and you go over into fantasy or pornography, you are going to damage your life. It affects your own sexuality."
From: Douglass Weiss, Ph.D., Good Enough To Wait (Fort Worth: Discovery Press Video).
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Will masturbation keep you out of heaven? Well, no more than any other sin, and it, like any other sin can be forgiven. Masturbation among males is very common – 92% of males masturbate at one time or another, even after marriage or during a sexual relationship (and some people say the other 8 % lied when taking the survey). The female percentage is 55%. So, don’t feel alone, by any means. (But just because everyone else does it, doesn’t mean you have to.)
Ask yourself why you do it, and what you get from it. Certainly if you masturbate INSTEAD of intercourse outside of marriage, that would be preferable, but, as Pam says, something that is “less wrong” is not necessarily right.
If you become obsessed with it and do it several times a week or even several times a day, and view pornography while doing it, then you may have a serious addiction that can be every bit as powerful and dangerous a disease as alcoholism or drug addiction. If you do it only once in a while, it’s not going to hurt you. And yes, it DOES feel good, and wrong, all at the same time. Much like any other sin.
How do you stop? Pray, pray, pray – turn your thoughts to something else. Read your Bible, take a cold shower. How do you stop other sins? Gluttony, envy, pride, you name it. Sin is sin, and ANYthing that takes you away from a closer relationship with God is sin.
Will you ever stop sinning? Nope, you’re human. Don’t beat yourself up over it (no pun intended). Just try to focus on something else. If masturbation becomes an addiction, then start worrying. If it’s only once in a while, I wouldn’t worry about it.
Proverbs 6:25 - Do not lust in your heart after her beauty or let her captivate you with her eyes.
Ephesians 4:19 - Having lost all sensitivity, they have given themselves over to sensuality so as to indulge in every kind of impurity, with a continual lust for more.
Colossians 3:5 - Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature: sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed, which is idolatry.
1 Thessalonians 4:4-6 - that each of you should learn to control his own body in a way that is holy and honorable, not in passionate lust like the heathen, who do not know God; and that in this matter no one should wrong his brother or take advantage of him. The Lord will punish men for all such sins, as we have already told you and warned you.
