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Chrysler Repair/'96 Cirrus 2.4L No Start - fault code 42

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QUESTION: Hi Roland,
Continuing the follow-up here - with your last answer I did not get an option for another follow-up question.
Here's what we found:
EGR valve seems okay, moves easily and seems to seat well.
Switched the ASD relay with the headlamp relay, no apparent effect, still could not start.

Checked the fuses and voltages again:
Fuse 15 in the eng. comp. is good, 0 volts ignition off, 0.08 ignition on
cabin fuse 9 same as last time
cabin fuse 11 0v ign off, 1.2v ign on
eng comp fuse 7 0v ign off, 1.2v ign on

I'm still with you - the car is a few miles away, so I have to go back to it each time.
Let me know what to do next.
Thank you very much for all the help so far.
Kurt

ANSWER: Hi Kurt,
Fuse 15 in the eng. comp. was not listed originally, but that fuse is attached directly to the battery so it aught to have 12v always unless it is blown.
That would explain why there is no voltage on fuse 9 in the cabin. That #9 fuse's 12v goes to the body computer, so that would impair many things, but not starting/running I would think. In any case either fuse 15 is blown or the incoming pin is not connected to the battery as it should be.
Cabin fuse 11 should show 12v when the ignition switch is in the off-run-start position and if not then check fuse 7 in the engine compartment to be blown, or for the ign. switch to be bad, or it could be a disconnect somewhere between the fuse 7 and the ignition switch at its pin 1 (red/light blue wire).
A ha! we do see no voltage on eng comp 7 which should be hot all the time because it is connected to the battery.
So check fuse 7 for continuity also, and fuse 15 in the eng. comp for continuity. When you say a fuse is 'good' do you mean visually or by checking its continuity with an ohm meter?
Once we have the fuses fixed things may be better.
Feel free to do another rating/nomination if you choose.
Roland

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Hi Roland,
I have been checking all of the fuses with an ohm meter, and they have all been good. And when I check for voltage, I have the fuse removed and touch my probes to the contacts. Is this correct method?

Since all the fuses have been good, that points to either the ignition switch or the connection from eng comp 7 and ign switch pin 1. When you say ignition switch, do you mean the switch on the steering column? I can get the engine to crank no problem, is that what pin 1 feeds?

Thanks,
Kurt

ANSWER: Hi Kurt,
No, voltage is typically measured between a point of interest and chassis ground which is any shiny structural metal surface nearby or to any black wire which is attached to the metalwork.
Measuring between the fuse socker contacts doesn't really tell you clearly what is going on because while one contact may have 12v on it from the battery, the other may not at that point in time be attached to anything at the far end so of course the meter will read 0.
So I think we are back to the fault code 42 needing to be addressed as it has to do with the fuel supply. I will look at my fault code manuals and see what I can suggest.
Next time you go to the car do verify the 42 code is still present.
Try listening for the fuel pump located inside the fuel tank. Stand at the rear, crouch down, have a helper turn the key to the run position. Listen for a humming sound that should only last for about 1 second. Do you hear it?
Then try switching the automatic shot down relay, in the rear of the eng. comp fuse box, with the high speed fan relay next to it in the box. Try again to listen for the hum.
Then try switching the fuel pump relay in the front part of that same box, with wiper high/low relay located next to it in the box.
We need to be sure the fuel pump will run, and listening for it as described will tell us.
When you turn the key to start the fuel pump runs again but you may not be able to hear it over the sound of the starter moter.
Roland

The easiest way to check the fuel pump is to remove the fuel pump relay, and then jump a wire between the sockets 27 and 35, (which are the two side by side, inboard, in the relay socket. Listen for the pump. If not heard then that you have 12v on pin 35 (the inboard-most pin.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Hi Roland,
Thanks again for the additional info. Got more information for you.
Fault codes are the same as before - 12, 42, 33.
Checked the voltages again, this time to the chassis ground terminal in the engine compartment.  
Fuse  Where    Ign On   Ign Off
15   Eng Comp  12.2     12.3
10   Eng Comp  12.3     0
9    Eng Comp  12.3     0
8    Eng Comp  12.3     12.3
7    Eng Comp  12.2     12.4
5    Eng Comp  12.2     12.3
5    Cabin     12.2     12.2
9    Cabin     12.2     12.4
11   Cabin     12.2     0
Things make a bit more sense now,except Cabin #11 which you had said should be 12v even with the ignition off.
We checked for the humming sound of the fuel pump, could not hear it, even when laying on the ground with my head under the gas tank. We had left the relays switched last night so the High Speed Fan relay is in the ASD position. We will do the other switch and the jumper method tomorrow and will let you know results. Ran out of light and didn't have anything to jump the sockets with me.
Again, thank you for your expert help.
Kurt

Answer
OK, I'll await the results.
On cabin fuse 11, it is supposed to get 12v with the ignition off (but not when the switch in the 'locked' position). So check it again. It powers the instrument cluster and body control module so if it were indeed 0 in the Off position, it might affect something having to do with the cluster or the body circuits...but I doubt it has anything to do with the no start.
I will be interested in whether you can get/hear the fuel pump trying the different things I suggested.
Roland

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Roland Finston

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