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About Andrew
Expertise
I don't object to Witness theology, but rather their use of social pressure & deceptive manipulations to undermine family ties & control minds. (This may seem contradictory to Witnesses, who draw no distinction between spiritual belief & organizational policy.) I do not engage in theological debate. I support persons impacted by an experience with the Witnesses & advocate early education for everyone so that they can protect themselves from cults by understanding what to watch out for.

(Ex-)Witnesses: I know how upsetting it is to experience doubts (or anger) about your experience. Time does not heal this wound until you first remove the splinter, which takes more time & effort than you may realize. So unless you have already put in that time & effort, don't be surprised if you are deeply affected long after the experience. But there is good news! You're NOT an enemy of God for doubting or for failing to meet the requirements of a human organization. People who lie cannot represent a God of Truth. Tell me where you're at. I'll understand. I can show you how to begin or continue your recovery & make a life for yourself worth living.

Non-Witnesses: Describe your experience with your friend/relative who is (becoming) a Witness. I can help you understand the Witness indoctrination & social dynamics that are affecting him or her (which are probably not apparent to you). I can help you put your options into perspective. Keep in mind that people make their own choices, & you may not be able to affect this person's choices, no matter how much they impact on you. A few people manage to do so, but don't count on it.

Despite my struggle to recover from my experience with the Witnesses, it was worth it. I will never let anyone cloud my clarity of mind again. Let me use that clarity to help you gain clarity. You deserve it. Every living thing deserves truth, compassion, discovery, and wonder; not manipulation, judgementalism, dogma, or control.

Experience

I was a Witness for 30 years, and a volunteer at their headquarters in Brooklyn, New York, for a year. I have attended many congregations across the United States, carefully observing patterns of behavior. Although being a Witness was difficult and I gradually had more and more doubts about Witness teachings, I was a true believer, so I kept trying to make it work somehow. I stopped attending meetings in 1997 only after receiving an answer to a prayer about doing so, and have since been actively involved in recovery, both my own, and supporting others in theirs. Recovery can include reading books, communicating with others in recovery, and participating in support groups and/or therapy. It always involves reclaiming one's own mind and discovering the other sides of the issues that you have been blinded to in the past.

The Witness organization is not like other churches. Most non-Witnesses really cannot imagine what it is like to be a Witness. The organization has unimaginably extensive rules and monitoring that affect every aspect of life (so there is no privacy and no sense of personal independence).

The organization insists on absolute conformity, and claims to directly represent God; so dissent is not tolerated, and authority is totalitarian. Being a Witness is more like living in China or the former Soviet Union than being a member of a religion as you know it. It was the research of Robert J. Lifton, WHO WAS STUDYING TOTALITARIAN GOVERNMENT BEHIND THE IRON CURTAIN, that first began to illuminate the problem of totalitarian cult religions around the world.

Witnesses often experience extremely dysfunctional lives and problems including broken family ties, stunted social development, inner unrest resulting from repressed doubts, inability to defend boundaries, and an extreme, persistent feeling of shame for no apparent reason. I can help people impacted by an experience with the Witnesses by revealing in detail the policies and social dynamics in the Witness organization that cause these problems.

My gradual awakening was socially, psychologically, and spiritually tumultuous. I lost everything from my former life. My suffering was epic.

But I have gained everything, so it was worth it. Only after beginning my recovery, I gained social, psychological, and spiritual healing and growth; I gained peace of mind; I gained self-respect; I discovered who I am; and for the first time I discovered the meaning of real brotherly love.

For more resources on this topic, try these web sites:
http://freeminds.org/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freedomofmind/

You are here: Experts > Religion/Spirituality > Jehovah's Witnesses > Critics of Jehovah`s Witnesses > Young love between a Baptist and a Witness

Critics of Jehovah`s Witnesses - Young love between a Baptist and a Witness

Expert: Andrew - 11/4/2009

Question
I'm 15 years old. And I am a Baptist young man. I have fallen in love with a wonderful young girl but she is a Jehovah's Witness. I have known for about 6 months now. We met at school. But we have so much in common. I talked to her mother one day. And she told me that I sound like a nice young man that is well mannered and loving. But she also said that she and her husband our trying to raise her daughter to be a pure Christian. But I had always thought that J.Witnesses weren't Christians like Baptist or Methodist. I wanna pursue a relationship with my friend one day I hope for us to be Boyfriend and Girlfriend.. But I doubt that now cause of her beliefs.... I've done my research and her beliefs sound correct but almost like they're man made religious faith. I don't wanna separate from GOD by converting to her faith and She feels the same.... But we both don't wanna stop our current friendship or stop dreaming about our future together.... What should we do ????

Answer
Dear Terrence,

> her mother said she and her husband are trying to raise
> her daughter to be a pure Christian. But I had always thought
> that J.Witnesses weren't Christians

Witnesses consider themselves primitive Christians, that is, like the followers of Christ in the first century when Christianity was pure, before it supposedly deviated from the pure teaching of Christ. That is the way they see themselves, not the way I see them.

Non-Witnesses generally think of Witnesses as non-Christian because they don't subscribe to the celebration of Christmas and the doctrine of the Trinity, which non-Witnesses often think of as core aspects of Christianity. It's all in how you define the word "Christian". The Witnesses are certainly not like the mainstream protestant religions.

Most primarily, the Witnesses are different because they practice cult mind control and actively damage family ties. As I understand it, mainstream protestant religions such as Methodist and Lutheran don't do that. I don't know about the Baptist church.

> I wanna pursue a relationship...but I doubt that now cause
> of her beliefs

I can see why her beliefs would make you think twice. Is it possible she would change her mind, or is she determined to continue a Witness lifestyle?

> I've done my research and her beliefs sound correct

Many things can be made to SOUND correct. Does that mean they really are?

> ...but almost like they're man made religious faith

All religious traditions are man made, are they not? The problem is not that we might participate in a religious tradition that is man made. That's not a problem because it's simply honest. Rather the problem is when a religious tradition claims to be made by God, and therefore have more authority to speak for God, telling you how to think and how to live your life, without ever having proved that the religion was made by God or the leaders were appointed by God. The reason it's a problem is because it's dishonest.

If someone claims to speak for God--a very extraordinary claim--then they'd better have extraordinary evidence that they were appointed by God to do that. Without such evidence, the claim is empty, and carries no authority. It's a lie. Lies have no authority to tell people what to think or how to live.

In answer to a prayer, God himself may inspire individuals to an experience of faith that is not man made. That may be what you are hoping for when you imply something better than "man made religious faith". That would be a beautiful thing.

But even in that ideal situation of a divinely-made spiritual experience, once the inspired individual writes down, interprets, or repeats the experience, it becomes his interpretation of what occurred (not the original experience), and therefore becomes a man-made system, does it not? The process of writing down, interpreting, or repeating the experience turns it from a spiritual experience into an intellectual one, which is a fundamentally different form.

So I think where we are seeking a spiritual path that is truly from God, we have to tune in to inspiration and wonder and let go of intellect, doctrine, and law. Spiritual experience does not involve intellect, it involves touching that which is beyond intellect, does it not?

> I don't wanna separate from GOD by converting to her faith

I don't know about your faith as a Baptist. I don't know whether Baptist doctrines are closer to God than Witness doctrines. That is for each individual to decide prayerfully.

However, what I do know is that the Witnesses generally practice an intellectual process instead of faith and call that "faith". So I believe if you converted to become a Witness, you would perhaps be more separate from God, not because Baptist doctrines are closer to God, but because the Witness practice is to substitute intellect for faith, which completely circumvents faith, and that is likely to move you further away from God, in my limited view.

I am not an expert on spiritual matters; just on sociological matters involving cult mind control, and how it is used to impair freedom of mind and damage family relationships.

> we both don't wanna stop our current friendship or stop
> dreaming about our future together.... What should we do ?

I can't tell you what you should do. Only you can decide that for yourself. All I can do is shed light on the situation, as far as it falls under my area of expertise, to support you in making an informed decision.

Perhaps a worthwhile goal is for you to expand your dream. Consider what would be likely to occur if you pursue the relationship, and let that likelihood become part of the dream. Sit with that dream for awhile until it becomes clear to you what is most likely to occur in the future--not only what you wish for, but also what is likely to occur in the real world based on what we know and can reasonably predict.

Based on what I know of Witness parents, and what you've said about your girlfriend's mother, I can tell you it's extremely unlikely your girlfriend's parents would ever accept you as a legitimate husband for her daughter. Your in-laws would treat you badly. In their belief system, you would be causing their daughter to lose her eternal life; which is almost as bad as you murdering her. To them. True or not, their belief system really causes them to feel that way. How would that affect your relationship with your in-laws, and your children's relationship with their grandparents?

I suggest you talk to married people who have a good relationship with their in-laws, and talk to other married people who have a bad relationship with their in-laws. Try to understand from their perspective how that experience affects their quality of life.

Then formulate a vision of what life would be like for you and your girlfriend if you pursue a relationship with her; and include that vision in your dream about a future together with her. This might help you decide if this dream is one you would really want to live out or not.

Please let me know if you have any further specific questions.

Good luck,
AndrewXJW

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