Electric Motors/Leland Motor

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Question
Hi Will,

Just read your write-up on the Leland motor.  I have a similar motor if not the same, Ref # 14052 KN 8059.  It has the same characteristics as the other gentleman's.

What is happening; the elevator at the extremes of up and down, will not start.  If I go down to the motor and turn the armature very little it starts immediately and runs till the end perfectly. I do see arcing through the air holes while running.

Mike at IECONY elevator in NJ said the brushes were worn and they can not be had.

So can you get me a new set of brushes to save this otherwise great motor?

Let me know,
Neal Wittels


Answer
NEal,  iT LIKELY IS THE BRUSHES,  however, it is also likely the brush springs have lost tension, and the face of the commutator is in need of dressing,  as it is probably worn and grooved,


Here is a ton of information,  if you can source some parts, great if you want to try taking it apart and sending me some photos I can try and give you a better idea,  of what is likely wrong,     but there is about all my Leland references and advise below,      you never know,  an ad in a forum like smokstak or somewhere might produce some parts,     either way you want to go   let me know if you get stuck and if so I can help guide you       

If you get new brushes    which you can,     it might help for a while,  but it depends on the spring pressures, and the surface of the comm that the brushes ride on,       

You could try a new set of brushes  [probably won't be cheap as there is a minimum  order so you might have to buy 3 sets to make minimum]


Have you had it to a local motor shop?   You might try sourcing parts by the manufacturer of the elevator  last LONG LINK       


It is possible the only problem is dust and contaminates in the holders     locking the brushes  but with the arcing      it is again likely there are other issues,


If you want to take good photos  and mark the parts  so I can get a look at the interior of the motor, I might be able to tell you more,        if you want to send me some photos,  just mark the parts with a small drill     not a marker that rubs off,        

Take photos as you go,  and maybe we can see how bad things are     or ARE NOT   !!!!!!!!


You can try here for brushes and springs    [I have used them in the past but a LONG time ago as I recall]  normally I just send a sample to Helwig Carbon Brush

http://store.advancecarbon.com/prostores/servlet/-strse-Carbon-Brush-cln-By-OEM-  

http://www.smokstak.com/forum/search.php?searchid=5577672
Also you can try Eurton Electric motors, [I have used them for parts and actually small tiny armature rewinds  very good ] Eurton below

Or  

Helwig Carbon   [This is where most get all industrial brushes IF they have this Leland in their database they may have them  but most likely you will need to send samples and also a sample of the brush holders and or springs]

This will be the most reliable but costly option

http://www.helwigcarbon.com/


http://store.eurtonelectric.com/brushes.aspx  

Then you really need to have someone take a look at the commutator,     if this is an elevator with passenger[s]   you want to make sure there is little chance of something going wrong or jerking a person off, or if a freight or dumb waiter  then dropping something   is a hazard,  


I would try to find a reliable motor shop,  and let them see what they can do or will do,   

The motors are COOL and OLD and sometimes valuable,     but it just depends,  as the model is probably a part number for the elevator not a LELAND MOTOR MODEL    off the shelf  number


So it is complex issue,       without seeing it   I cannot give you probabilities of what needs to be replaced, but if it works then it wont start your buddy is probably correct but good brushes with bad springs  doesnt help  it might just because the new brushes will be taller and less worn but over time and maybe a short time,   it will go back to sticking and not starting,    

Now  here is another option,   if the elevator is a stair lift   maybe a new stair lift is in order,      

It has been arcing  so that means it has some damage     how much ???

Are there external limit switches and or mechanical switches?

Does this motor go right into a gearbox?

Is the shaft straight or tapered or splined?

If you could find a small motor that would fit all the logistical issues you could use a small three phase motor,  with single phase in  three phase out phase convertor,       

These are amazing devices    VFDS       variable frequency drives,   and they convert single to three phase with reversing, overload  ramp speed,  decel speeds  braking,   everything in one controller,         

Im going to guess a half horse or less,      [I get a lot of questions hard to remember particular motor question]

If so  you can probably buy the three phase motor,   and VFD drive for about the cost of one repulsion induction or other single phase motor with a ton of low end torque    most work better than DC       but the retrofit   reverse engineering is what I dont know     if it is going to be a huge deal to get a standard motor in place and then interface the controls,    

If you can  you will have a motor and drive that will outlast the structure,       

http://www.wolfautomation.com/ProductList.aspx?CategoryID=5103


This is a good place to start       remember the drive is only complicated if someone does not study the manual,  the V TECh drives have around 46 user programmable settings,  way past speed and braking and reversing and ramp up ramp down,    it has overload protection for the motor built in,   can be used with analog and digital inputs       it is really very simple for all you can do with one,          if the motor is so obsolete,   either a new elevator or figure out how to reverse engineer in a new drive and three phase motor,    


But leave this for last,     get an opinion at a motor shop,  if they will work on it,  many wont work with single phase anymore,        but they may give you a honest evaluation if the comm is burned badly and not to waste money on brushes,  so on,

 Leland repulsion induction motor, Type RD, 1/2 hp,FR. 4c66z, 230 v., Duty 1/2hr, 8.8 amp,1725 rpm, PH 1, CY 60,Ref.14052 PU 4777


If it is close to this one,  the frame 66 can be dealt with   the z after the frame   size  66Z means it is special somehow,   spline, wood key,  a dozen mods,  possible   and there might be another used one out there  but then you risk a used motor with as many issues as yours,         

also try  surplusrecord.com

then if they have anything close   it would be

http://www.plccenter.com/Brand/LELAND%20FARADAY


long shot

http://www.industrial-electronics.com/elecy4_23.html


http://vintagemachinery.org/mfgindex/detail.aspx?id=2025

http://www7.buyerpricer.com/landing.aspx?slk=elevator+parts&nid=2&cid=6172706943  

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Will

Expertise

Three phase/ AC DC single phase motors, controls, any problems or failures, motor installation, performance issues, connections. All other electric motors/gearboxes/apparatus. Specialty repair concerns, obsolete motors and solutions. Other mechanical or specialty equipment. See my profile under Home/electrical at this site

Experience

30 plus years in the electrical motor and apparatus repair industry. VP level management of repair facilities, current owner of my own specialty repair and consulting firm.

Organizations
EASA, IBEW [retired], other specialty organizations, Lubrication, Vibration EDI, Tribo-electric Councils

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Currently fielding concerns at this site under "Home Electrical"

Education/Credentials
4 year technical, College level specific courses, EASA repair courses, vibration analysis electronic and electrical trade school.

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