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About Carol Blaha
Expertise
Flooring questions: Specification, Warranties, Inspections, Product Knowledge, Enviromental Issues

Experience
I have been in the field 25 years, first as a specifier, then retailer and currently manufacturer representative on contract with 8 manufacturers, independent inspector and conduct moisture testing. Founding board member of the CO Chapter, US Green Building Council

Organizations
WFCA (World Floor Covering Association), NTCA (National Tile Council America) SCRT (Society of Cleaning & Restoration Technician), ASTM F60, (Environment) and F06 (Resilient Floor)

Publications
Colorado Real Estate Journal, Smart Buildings

Education/Credentials
MBA, CTC (Certified Tile Consultant), RRT (Carpet Repair & Reinstallation), CCT (Carpet Cleaning Technician, ISSI (Substrate Inspection) and completed coursework for Independent Ceramic Tile Inspector, Hardwood/Laminate Inspector and Senior Carpet Inspector. Scheduled to complete Independent Resilient Inspector in April.

Awards and Honors
Multiple Awards for Salesperson of Year and President's Club

Past/Present Clients
Clients include Fortune Co's to mom and pop

You are here: Experts > Style > Interior Decorating > Flooring and Carpeting > cupped and buckled engineered floor

Flooring and Carpeting - cupped and buckled engineered floor

Expert: Carol Blaha - 11/5/2009

Question
QUESTION: Hi Carol,
My engineered wood flooring is cupped and buckled. It is in various spots in the dining rm and living rm.I have had the manufacture rep come out and he has said the cause is not the product but most likely due to moisture.The store/contractor came out and said they are not liable because of unforeseen moisture. A moisture test was just done today and it appeared ok but I was told maybe I have a drainage problem. I originally wanted the floor floated using underlayment but the store/contractor advised me to have it glued instead. I feel this would not be and issue if it was. They have offered to help in the cost of replacement but I feel it was their responsibility to insure against moisture damage and should remove the floor and install it correctly. Do I have any recourse and what actions can I take?

ANSWER: If this installation is on slab and the contractor didn't test for moisture-- it should be on their nickel. Email me back if the install is on wood.

It's not the installers responsibility to insure against moisture. But it is their responsibility to test for moisture prior to installation of the floor when on concrete. ALL manufacturers require this. If you know the manufacturer you can download the install instructions and I bet you a nickle it's in there.

What exactly did it mean when it came out OK? There is no "ok", they should know how many # of moisture is coming from the subfloor or % relative humidity. How did they test?

The manufacturer should not have sent out the manufacturer rep. He is biased. They should have sent out an independent inspector (like us) to give a non-biased report. The inspector would test for moisture using a meter that is non-intrusive. This is an indicator only- but it will point out issues. And this "probably" stuff is just BS. You can come back with "probably" its a manufacturing defect?? That's an irresponsible comment.

Your recourse is to - -download the install instructions and point out they did not follow them. If they had tested for moisture, they would have pointed it out to you- and they should have stopped the job. Tell them you will hire your own independent inspector. The inspector will give you a doc that is based on fact and industry standard. This doc will go a long way should you have to take them to small claims court. And tell them you will.

You can find an independent inspector by going to IICRC.org, or NWFA. I am also part of a network of inspectors-- I can usually get it done for less than $250.00. Just let me know your zip. Should the inspection affirm the above-- it is reasonable to expect the contractor to replace product and reimburse you for the inspection.

However -- if there is a moisture problem- it will happen again if we don't do something different. I can coach you on that too.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Thanks Carol for such a quick response. To answer your questions- The foundation is concrete. The contractor used a meter, he didn't say what the moisture measured to but just that it was within range. The flooring rep also did a meter for the moisture test. He said it read within acceptable range but when used on an area without flooring(we are preparing to put down tile) by the fireplace and the washroom then it had a higher reading. Also the majority of damage is in the center of both rooms not by the exterior walls.I also question them not sealing the concrete before laying down the floor and only relying on the adhesive as the sealant. It was the recommended adhesive for the floor (as stated by the manufacturer rep). I have also requested a copy of any moisture testing that supposedly was done prior to installation. We'll see if I get that since it's taken me three months to get these guys out here and I had to threaten reporting them to the contractors board to get them here.One more thing. This work was done with a construction loan and owners where we purchased the floor had to sign papers with my lender.I don't know when or if I should get the bank involved since it is in their interest to have the floor done right. I am in northern California/ Sacramento area.Thanks

ANSWER: If the reading is done-- after the fact-- after the problem occured-- it's on their nickel. Did you see them perform test before installation?? What kind of meter? If this is not documented-- how and where-- you have basis for claim. If there is no documentation you can only assume it wasn't done or done correctly.

Who is the manufacturer-- I can review the installation guidelines and tell you further.

They don't care abut contractors board. Really.

Center of the house? Certainly not drainage due to landscaping. What's under the center of the house-- crawl space?

Floor does not have to be sealed, in fact many manufacturers don't want it done as it's a bond breaker for glue.

If it's a construction loan sometimes those checks have to be signed by you as well as bank-- either way, get on it and call them to resind payment.

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Thanks again Carol- No there is no crawl space it is a slab foundation. As for the meter I have no idea what brand just that I was told it would detect moisture. Are you telling me to find out from them just what was used and what it measured,and for me to write this all down?I'm sorry if I seem a little dense.The manufacturer was LM Flooring. Yes it was a construction loan but the monies have already been disbursed. My thinking is Wells Fargo still has an interest in the home since they are the lenders. They were very adamant that I had to go through a licensed contractor for reasons just like this. Otherwise I would have done the work myself. Thanks again

Answer
I'm sorry to be dense- but did he do the test with the meter before the install-- or as in your follow up post-- after the buckling occurred?

http://www.lmflooring.com/documents/EngineeredHardwood.doc

This is LM's install requirements. Read and look for variances. See that they require calcium chloride moisture tests, or acceptable moisture meter BEFORE install. 3# is very low-- most manufacturers now go 5 or above. That just reinforces the critical need for moisture detection BEFORE installation.

This floor is ok to float or nail. Why did they insist on glue? They could have floated it with a moisture retarder.

You have a lot of ground to stand on. Yes, rile up Wells Fargo. They can put pressure on them. Contact LM claims dept, that is another place to apply pressure. Tell Wells if they don't get involved their home is about to lose value. Call your insurance co- they would have a vested interest in averting a claim.

Most manufacturers will not rely on factory reps for inspections. I know, I was one for upteen years. My guess is LM is not aware of the issue. Or they would have sent out an independent.

I am working on a white paper on "mistakes consumers make" in filing claims Unfortunately this site will only allow me to send pix. I will work on scanning it, so I can forward at a later time.

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