QUESTION: Hello BK
I see you're a new expert here but from what I've seen you're the best ever! You give clear, detailed answers. Others would answer like "gorilla vs grizzly bear: bear easily" and the answer is clearly rushed. Anyway onto my question.
1. Allosaurus vs torvosaurus. seemingly oth of these appeared in Late Jurassic North America, but Allosaurus was described as the top predator. Who was more dominant between these two?
2. Albertosaurus vs carnotosaurus/torvosaurus/allosaurus
3. Daspletosaurus vs torvosaurus/allosaurus
4. Tyrannosaurus vs diplodicus/camarasaurus
5. Giganotosaurus vs ankylosaurus/triceratops
6. Therizinosaurus vs allosaurus/torvosaurus/mapusaurus
Thanks in advance for the answers!
ANSWER: Hello Max. Thank you for the kind words.
Allosaurus vs Torvosaurus: The range of Allosaurus' size varies somewhat, but a full-grown one was probably between 2 and 2.5 tons; perhaps peaking at 3. I've seen estimates up to 4.5 tons, but that is probably outdated information. The Torvosaurus reached over 2 tons in weight, and was similar in build to an Allosaurus (some think it may have actually been an Allosaurus or kin to one). At equal weights I consider these 2 to be close; a size advantage would point the arrow to the heavier dinosaur. Another school of thought is the possibility the Allosaurus hunted in packs or in pairs. If this was the case, the numbers advantage would lead to a dominant encounter (unless, of course, the Torvosaurus also hunted in packs).
Albertosaurus vs Carnotaurus/Torvosaurus/Allosaurus: The Albertosaurus not would have crossed paths with these 3 (different time/location), but would have dominated any hypothetical encounter that didn't feature a numbers advantage. It was 3 tons in weight (as high as the Allosaurus' top reliable estimate). The Carnotaurus was lightly built (probably 1.1 tons) and could probably move more swiftly than the others. It had a short skull (strong bite force, though) and short arms. It had 2 bony protrusions over its eyes, and may have fought others of its kind by ramming heads (much like rams of today or the thick-skulled Pachycephalosaurus). However, this would not have been combat-effective against the much larger Albertosaurus.
Daspletosaurus vs Torvosaurus/Allosaurus: Daspletosaurus was probably on par with Albertosaurus in regards to size & formidability (its head was actually bigger). It would have little problem with these 2 one-on-one. It may have crossed paths with Albertosaurus on occasion (which would make for an interesting encounter).
Tyrannosaurus vs Diplodocus/Camarasaurus: The Diplodocus is a very long dinosaur with a relatively light build. Reliable estimates for its weight are between 2-3 African elephants (max 20 tons). It was about 16ft at the top of its back. The Camarasaurus was shorter and stockier, but also reached about 20 tons. The Tyrannosaurus (7-8 tons) would have had a field day with these 2 (if they lived in the same time period). Their necks would be right in range for the therapod's fearsome jaws, and their only defense (striking with their tails) would only delay the inevitable. Larger sauropods (like Apatosaurus & Brachiosaurus) would have had better chances to repel the carnivore, but these 2 don't have the size or weaponry.
Giganotosaurus vs Ankylosaurus/Triceratops: Giganotosaurus was a huge theropod (8 tons), even larger than Tyrannosaurus rex. It didn't have the bite force of the Tyrannosaurus, but it was still a top-notch hunter. The triceratops (6 tons or more) and the anylosaurus (5 tons or more) were 2 of the most well-armed herbivores in the dinosaur world. Giganotosaurus wouldn't have actually met these 2 (different time periods & continents), but would have found penetrating their defenses problematic. If the theropod attacked the Triceratops, it would be faced with three sharp horns (2 long ones for impaling), a bony frill (to protect neck/shoulder area), and an elephant-sized adversary doing its best bulldozer impression. Although larger, the Giganotosaurus would not have been as used to facing a large ceratopsian as, let's say, the Tyrannosaurus. Giganotosaurus' primary prey items were sauropods. Triceratops, on the other hand, was constantly doing battle with large theropods. In the initial feeling-out period, the Triceratops would probably successfully defeat a Giganotosaurus as long as it kept the predator in front of it. However, as the Giganotosaurus adapted to hunting the smaller ceratopsians and worked its way up to the adults, it would figure out how to have greater success in this encounter. Against the Ankylosaurus, the same thing would apply. The Giganotosaurus would have to adapt and learn how to beat its defenses (heavy armor covering its head & back; club of bone at end of tail for swinging at enemies). Until this happened, the Ankylosaurus would crouch down to protect its underbelly and swing its club whenever the theropod came into range (and enjoy the fact the Giganotosaurus would initially have no clue on how to breach its defense).
Therizinosaurus vs Allosaurus/Torvosaurus/Mapusaurus: The Therizinosaurus would enjoy the advantage of being used to encountering large theropods (like T-rex) whereas the trio listed here never encountered a Therizinosaurus (different time periods & continents). The Therizinosaurus weighed about 3 tons (some estimates as high as 5) and had claws almost a meter long on its front limbs. These were used to slash at enemies to defend itself. It would probably succeed in keeping these 3 at bay until the predators adapted to taking this type of prey, but after that time arrived the Therizinosaurus would face stiff challanges from the Allosaurus and the Mapusaurus (both could reach 3 tons). The Torvosaurus' smaller size would deem it less of a threat, but it would still be capable of learning how to successfully conquer the Therizinosaurus. The weaknesses of the Therizinosaurus include a long neck (target for jaws) and poor speed & mobility. The 3 theropods would risk injury from those claws, but would eventually find an opening to deliver a fatal bite. A 5-ton version of this dinosaur would have a much better chance of fending off these 3 hunters, but there would be no guarantees once the adaptation process was complete.
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QUESTION: I'm a little boggled about torvosaurus. It's described as the biggest Jurassic carnivore besides saurophaganax. I look online and find measurements up to over 36 ft and 4 tons. Could it have been that big? At those sizes it could beat allosaurus/daspletosaurus/albertosaurus right? thanks
Hello again Max.
There are many variations in weight estimations for dinosaurs, and Torvosaurus is no different. The most consistent weight I've found for it is just over 2 tons. I've seen 2-3 tons as well. The Diplodocus, according to one source, weighed between 25-50 tons (which is grossly inaccurate). Diplodocus' max was about 20 tons, yet this exaggeration found its way to print. Another example is the wolverine. Some sources state its average weight to be as high as 25kg (max at 32kg), which is not the case at all (8-19kg is the more accurate range). Not all sources are reliable. The Saurophaganax is generally listed at 3 tons or 3-4 tons. I wouldn't rule out the possibility of a 4-ton Torvosaurus, but I believe it to be unlikely. It may have still been larger on average than Allosaurus (conservative estimates are around 2 tons; max 2-3 tons), but I wouldn't be comfortable going any higher than 3 tons. If there was a 4-ton Torvosaurus, it would certainly outweigh Allosaurus, and be the dominant theropod.