Expert: Daniel Selinski - 1/25/2009

Question
QUESTION: Daniel, I read only parts of your response to one of ur questioneer.

In regards to verse 16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds,

Can you reiterate on verse 17 some more, then WE WHICH ARE ALIVE and REMAIN shall be CAUGHT UP TOGETHER WITH THEM IN THE CLOUDS.

1. Caught up in the clouds with THEM, meaning with WHOM?
2. Are they CAUGHT UP while they are ALIVE?

thanxs!




ANSWER: (1 Thessalonians 4:17) 17 Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them,. . .

(2 Timothy 4:8) 8 From this time on there is reserved for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, will give me as a reward in that day, yet not only to me, but also to all those who have loved his manifestation.

So its talking about those who are already with the Lord.

at the time that they finish their earthly course faithfully in death, the remaining ones who have the invitation to “the evening meal of the Lamb’s marriage” are immediately resurrected to join their fellow members of the bride class in heaven. They do not “fall asleep in death” in the sense of waiting in a long sleep, as did the apostles but, on dying, are “changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, during the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised up incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

<<<< Are they CAUGHT UP while they are ALIVE?<<<<

NO , flesh and blood can't enter heaven and like the latter part says;

(1 Thessalonians 4:17) 17 Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them, be caught away. . .

This is no way a rapture where milliona are waiting to be lifted up into heaven,this heavenly resurrection began in 1918, after Jesus’ enthronement in 1914



---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: >>> (1 Thessalonians 4:17) 17 Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them,. . .

(2 Timothy 4:8) From this time on there is reserved for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, will give me as a reward in that day, yet not only to me, but also to all those who have loved his manifestation.

So its talking about those who are already with the Lord. <<<

I am also going to include the following verse:
1Th4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Are you trying to tell me that verse 17 is referring to those who are already ressurected from the dead and is with the lord?
If that is the case then verse 18 should not serve us as a means for comforting each other after those who were resurrected from the dead:  :16....and the dead in Christ shall rise first: In that case we shall also ignore the prior verses as well; 1Th4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
1Th4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
Verse 15 clearly states that there will be those who remained alive unto the coming of the Lord, and it will not prevent the resurrection of those who are dead in christ: 17 Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them, be caught away. . .


>>>> This is no way a rapture where milliona are waiting to be lifted up into heaven,this heavenly resurrection began in 1918, after Jesus’ enthronement in 1914 <<<<

This resurrection that you speak of, that began in 1918, was it by the call of the 5th trumpet?

And by the way 2timothy4:8 has nothing to do with this topic.

ANSWER: Get to the real point of you question Luis,are you not a regular on this forum?

"And by the way 2timothy4:8 has nothing to do with this topic."


Yes it does '

"So its talking about those who are already with the Lord.'

2 Timothy 4:8) 8 From this time on there is reserved for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, will give me as a reward in that day, yet not only to me, but also to all those who have loved his manifestation

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Now you get to the point, daniel. Are you trying to tell me to ignore those verses I mentioned??
Also answer those questions I asked you, or are you ignoring those verses?
I disagree, 2 Timothy 4:8, has nothing to do with this topic about the rapture.

Now go answer my questions, and stop being so defensive!

Answer
Again get to your real question,you only said this at the start:


QUESTION: Daniel, I read only parts of your response to one of ur questioneer.

In regards to verse 16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds,


I answerd this and explained what this was ,so now get to your main reason for contacting me.