Expert: Brenda Martin - 9/25/2009

Question
QUESTION: Good Morning Brenda.  Thank You So Very Much for your willingness to host questions and provide feedback.  It is truly appreciated.  My main question is, "Who does the bible pertain to?"  Basically, I have always felt and believed that the entire bible pertained to, and was written for everyone.  That it wholely applies to me.  That every word is inspired from God, and written for everyone.  I believe that it totally applies to me.  But then I read JW stuff, and that seems to exclude much of the bible to pertaining to me, and even most JW's.  That just doesn't seem right, and contradicts what I think the bible should be.  Where I see it the most is in what I understand the JW's to believe that only 144,000 saved, born again people will go to heaven.  That would mean that anything written about heaven would exclude everyone except those that are going to heaven.  Why write that much stuff about heaven if it doesn't apply to us. Now I understand that anyone CAN go to heaven, but most will not.  Most people are non christian and will not go to heaven.  When I say heaven, I see it as a combination of what most people call heaven, and what JW's believe to be paradise on earth.  I think that they will be part of the same thing.  Heaven being the New Jerusalem with the 12 gates which we will be allowed to come and go through.  The gates never close.  Paradise earth will be that which is outside New Jerusalem, but available to all who make it to heaven.  Why have gates if you can't go through them.  I've never seen anything that has that same theory, but that does not mean that it couldn't be that way.  I believe that the New Jerusalem will be 12,000 furlongs cubed.  I have had JW's tell me that it can't be because it's too big.  Well, my God who created the universe and all that is in it, can certainly make anything, any size that He wants to.  If He says it will be 12,000 furlongs cubed, with streets of pure gold, and 12 foundations of precious stones, and single pearl gates, and so on.  I will certainly believe that He means what He says.  Otherwise why inspire it to be written.  

Ok, back to the original question.  Is the bible written for everyone, and pertains to everyone.  If not, what parts do not apply to most people.  Now I understand that Most people reject the teachings, but that is by their own free will.  The bible still pertains to them, but they refuse it.  The muslims, hindu's, buddists, atheists and so on.  Those are the people I am talking about rejecting the bible.  But they could still come to Jesus and be saved and believe in the true Word of God.  But they probably won't.  

I hope my question makes enough sense to you to figure out what I am trying to ask.  I ramble a bit, and it's hard to convey feelings in writing a question.  There are many times in the bible were something is being told to someone.  I will use 3 John 1-2 as an example.  It says, "The older man to Gaius the beloved, whom I truly love.  Beloved one, I pry that in all things you may be propering and having good health just as your solul is prospering".  Now does that only apply to Gaius, or does it apply to anyone.  I believe it applies to anyone.  God does not descriminate and is a respector of no person.  That means He loves us all the same.  What He has for one, He has for all.  He is the same today, as He was yesterday, and will be tomorrow.  Of course we have to receive Him.  

Anyway, please figure out what I am trying to say, and explain your thoughts on the subject.  I am not a JW, but for being a non JW have a above average understanding of JW stuff. I was engaged to a JW and remain friends with her and her family.  That's been over 14 years now in which I have daily contact with at least one member of the family.  I have attended one memorial, listened to meetings by phone, and have studied some of the materials.  I believe some of the teachings but not all of them.  I believe some of Charles Russels teachings but not all of them.  I care about all my JW friends in which I have about 90 or so.  

Thanks again for your willingness to receive and answer questions.
God's Blessings... cliff

ANSWER: Hi there Cliff, nice to hear from you again, you asked--“WHO DOES THE BIBLE PERTAIN TO?"

The Hebrew Scriptures were written in the first place for the fleshly nation of Israel during the time that they had a special relationship with God. The Christian Greek Scriptures were written primarily for “the Israel of God,” those anointed as brothers of Christ and spiritual sons of God.

Of course, that in no way suggests that non-Israelites could not derive great benefit from studying the Hebrew Scriptures. Similarly, Christians who are not anointed with holy spirit derive immeasurable benefits from studying and living according to the counsel found in the Christian Greek Scriptures.—Read 2 Timothy 3:15-17.

"WHY WRITE THAT MUCH STUFF ABOUT HEAVEN IF IT DOESN'T APPLY TO US?"

Romans 15; 4 tells us why—“For all the things that were written aforetime were written for our instruction, that through our endurance and through the comfort from the Scriptures we might have hope.”

The importance of the Hebrew Scriptures cannot be overemphasized, for without their law code, history, and prophecies, much in the Christian Greek Scriptures would be doubtful in meaning. (Lu 24:27, 44) Yet the Hebrew Scriptures were written primarily for Natural Jews.

The Greek Scriptures were written primarily for Spiritual Jews; however we derive great benefit, comfort, hope & instruction from them.

Just as Paul explains—“Now these things went on befalling them (Jews) as examples, and they were written for a warning to US (anointed) upon whom the ends of the systems of things have arrived.” (1Co 10:11)

Paul wasn’t a Natural Jew, yet he saw the Hebrew Scriptures as pertinent to him & used what happened to the unfaithful Israelites as a warning example to Anointed Christians in Corinth.

"WHAT MOST PEOPLE CALL HEAVEN==WHAT JW'S BELIEVE TO BE PARADISE ON EARTH?"

No; couldn’t be more different; the place, bodies, lives.

Heaven is above, to reside there you need a spirit body & the lives of these ones are as “rulers”

Whereas Earth is right here on this planet, to reside here we have physical bodies & the lives of these ones will be as “subjects”

"PARADISE EARTH IS OUTSIDE NEW JERUSALEM, BUT STILL IN HEAVEN".  

Impossible because--Genesis 2:8 states: “Jehovah God planted a garden in Eden, toward the east, and there he put the man [Adam] whom he had formed.” There was an abundance of varied and fascinating plant and animal life. Jehovah blessed the first human pair and said to them: “Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving upon the earth.” (Gen. 1:28)

God’s original purpose was for all the earth to be a paradise populated by those who appreciatively obey his laws & it will not go unfulfilled as these scriptures show. (Isa. 45:18; 55:10, 11)

The Hebrew Scriptures had never led faithful Jews to expect a reward of heavenly life. Those Scriptures pointed to the restoration of Paradise here on earth. Daniel 7:13, 14 had foretold that when “rulership and dignity and kingdom” would be given to the Messiah, “the peoples, national groups and languages should all serve even him.” Those SUBJECTS of the Kingdom would be here on the earth.

By what the evildoer said to Jesus, he was evidently expressing the hope that Jesus would remember him when that time came. (John 5:28, 29) Jesus saw in the evildoer’s repentant and respectful attitude a basis for including him among the billions who will be resurrected to earthly life and the opportunity to prove their worthiness to live forever in Paradise.

NEW JERUSALEM IS LITERAL

It is an expression that occurs only twice, & both times in the highly SYMBOLIC book of Revelation. (Re 3:12; 21:2) Re 21:2.

When the Witness said “it can’t be real because it’s so large”, she meant it cannot be an EARTHLY CITY because being a cube; the city was also as high as it was long and wide. No man-made city could ever reach that far into “outer space.”

Also you said it has; “open gates” true; however although these gates were never closed, “anything not sacred and anyone that carries on a disgusting thing and a lie will in no way enter into it; only those written in the Lamb’s scroll of life will.” Re 21:22-27.

3 JOHN 1-2 SAYS, "THE OLDER MAN TO GAIUS THE BELOVED…” DOES THAT ONLY APPLY TO GAIUS, OR DOES IT APPLY TO ANYONE?

We’ve seen that the Hebrew Scriptures were written primarily for the Nation of Israel & the Greek Scriptures were written primarily for Anointed Christians, but all 66 books of the bible were written for all mankind to find “comfort, hope & instruction” We derive great benefit studying both the Hebrew & the Greek.

Gaius was commended by John for; walking in the truth, his hospitality, his faithful work & his love. By extension, those who desire to gain God’s approval should walk in his truth and serve him in truth also. (Joshua 24:14; 1Sa 12:24; Ps 25:4, 5; 26:3-6; 43:3; 86:11; Isa 38:3)

The entire body of Christian teachings, which later became part of the written Word of God, is “the truth” or “the truth of the good news.” Adherence to this truth, ‘walking’ in it, is essential if an individual is to gain salvation. (Ro 2:8; 2Co 4:2; Eph 1:13; 1Ti 2:4; 2Ti 4:4; Tit 1:1, 14; Heb 10:26; 2Jo 1-4; 3Jo 3, 4) so in the first instance it was being said about Gaius, but obviously we can learn from it.

HE LOVES US ALL THE SAME?

Yes of course God loves us all equally :¬) the fact that some will not go to heaven (myself included) does not in any way suggest different; a person doesn’t have to go to heaven to have a truly happy future.

Ps. 37:11: “The meek ones themselves will possess the earth, and they will indeed find their exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.”

Rev. 21:1-4: “I saw a new heaven and a new earth . . . I heard a loud voice from the throne say: ‘Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them. And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.’”

Mic. 4:3, 4: “They will not lift up sword, nation against nation, neither will they learn war anymore. And they will actually sit, each one under his vine and under his fig tree, and there will be no one making them tremble; for the very mouth of Jehovah of armies has spoken it.”

I can’t wait to live on a paradise earth :¬) ruled over by Jesus & the 144,000 anointed will be an absolute delight. Rev. 20:6: 1 Cor. 6:2: Rev. 5:10:

All the best
Brenda











---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Good morning and thank you so much for responding.  It had been awhile since I had asked you a question.  I appreciate you quick response.  For the most part I’ve been fine in my studies and stuff but there are times when someone asks something, or says something that contradicts my understandings.  That does not mean that I was correct in my understanding, and like a Berean I try and get the answers.  


You said: “The Christian Greek Scriptures were written primarily for “the Israel of God,” those anointed as brothers of Christ and spiritual sons of God.”     I did not know what “the Israel of God,” was but you explained it as, “those anointed as brothers of Christ and spiritual sons of God.”  Is that the same as all of us who are born again, and saved?    I know we read about the Jews and gentiles.  The Jews being the chosen people.  I have seemed to believe that we are the gentiles, (Christians).  The gentiles listened and received the “good news”.  I think that when the bible talks about “Jacobs trouble” it is referring to the Jews.  They are the lineage from Jacob.  That is not saying the Christians won’t be going through the tribulation.  Those that are still here anyway.  


You wrote:  Romans 15; 4 tells us why—“For ALL the things that were written aforetime were written for OUR instruction, that through our endurance and through the comfort from the Scriptures we might have hope.” (emphasis added)

  So what I asked about the bible being written for OUR instruction and that ALL things written in it is for everyone, was a correct assumption.  That is exactly what I have thought and believed.  I let someone try and convince me otherwise.  Thank you for straightening that out.  Now I know the historical writings of things that happened will not be something that I can do, but I can learn from it.  I know we don’t have multiple wives and concubines.  I know we don’t do animal sacrifices and all that.  But we can learn the history of it and how we have been brought out of that.  I probably will never be thrown in a furnace like Shadrack.  I doubt I’ll live 3 days in the belly of a fish.  I don’t pay my taxes from getting money out of a fishes mouth.  But I believe all those things happened.
I was mostly interested in knowing that when Jesus was telling someone something, it was like Him telling me the same thing.  To love one another, the parables, his teachings, everything He said was meant for me.  I am most believing in the things He said about salvation, and our eternal future.  When He said that He was going to prepare a place for me, and that He would return for me, I must believe that.  When He said my treasures are in heaven, I must believe that.  When He said that I must be born again to see the kingdom of God, I must believe that.  The only book that I can totally believe in and rely on is the Good Book.   I have never found a lie in the bible.  The word of God is the truth. When Jesus says that He is the way and the truth and the life and that no one comes to the Father except through him, I believe Him.  Jesus himself claimed to be the only way to the Father and the source of eternal truth and life.  That must be the truth.  I believe it.  Now one thought I have on that is that once we “have” Jesus, then we can go to the Father.  I know the model prayer tells us to “our Father”.  Jesus being the only way to the Father means that unless we are saved, we can’t get to the Father.  Does that make sense?  Now I’m going by what the bible says.  I do know that at Pentecost 3000 were saved and the numbers were added to daily.  Well, there have been over 700,000 days since Pentecost, and I know that there were other days where many more were added to and the numbers are continued to be added to.  Which is a great thing because that is what we are suppose to be doing.  Adding to the numbers of the Church.  We are the church.  The group of born again saved believers.  In my mind there are only two groups of people.  Those of us whose name is written in the Lambs book of life, and those whose name is not written.  That’s it.  Those are the only two groups of people that matter.  We are either saved and born again, or we are not.  We are heaven bound, or we are not.  We are either not going into the lake of fire or we are.  Anyway, that’s how I see it and feel about it.  I know who my judge will be.  It’s not the pope, Billy Graham, Joel Osteen, or the watchtower, the mormons, or any other group.  It’s amazing to me that most people just don’t get it.  They just don’t believe that Jesus died for their sins so that they can have eternal life.  He died before we were even here, and He would have died just for you, or for me, and He thinks we are worth His dying for.  That is so amazing to me.  He wants that no one should perish.  Most will perish.  Most do not have their name written in the book of life.  Most will be cast into the lake of fire.  It has been estimated that about 75 billion people have lived.  The majority of those are non Christian.  I think that at best there are 10 – 12% that are Christian.  Most of those are lukewarm.  I use to be the perfect one hour a week Christian.  I would show up on Sunday morning for an hour, warm a pew, lip the words while my mind was a million miles away.  That was before I was saved.  Of course when you are first saved you don’t have a clue what’s going on.  You just know that you are born again and are a new creature and starting out on the narrow road.  For me that was about 17 years ago.  My 2 year old son was going into the operating room to have open heart surgery.  I was very much in the world at that time.  Not in a bad way, just in the money way.  Which is bad enough.  I never did drugs or anything like that.  We were building a million dollar mansion, and stuff was suppose to make me happy.  Then my son needed open heart surgery.  As they wheeled him in I realized I may never see him again.  That’s when I realized there was something much greater to life than stuff.  I committed my life to Christ and started my walk with Him.  I went from getting stuff for me, to giving stuff to others.  We stayed in the house that we had which was a temporary home that I bought sight unseen while the mansion was being built.  But you know what, it was just fine.  I have since given away millions and continue to do so.  I have less stuff than I ever have, but I am the most content, happy, have peace and joy, and faith.  It’s awesome.  I know that I am but here for a blink in time, but I will have all eternity with my Lord and Savior.  That’s the promise from Jesus.  I am saved by grace and not by works.  There is nothing that I could ever do enough of to earn salvation.  And if we could earn it Jesus would not have had to die for the forgiveness of my sins.  Oh, I’m not perfect, far from it.  But I am forgiven, and I am saved.  What a relief and a blessing that it.  
Boy did this go a different direction.    But you know what.  Before I started writing this I prayed and asked the Holy Spirit to help me.  He is our helper you know.  Anyway,  I’m not sure what I wrote but for some reason it’s the right thing.
Thanks again.  There’s probably a question in my writings somewhere.  Have a great and blessed day…..cliff


ANSWER: “THE ISRAEL OF GOD, ANOINTED BROTHERS OF CHRIST AND SPIRITUAL SONS OF GOD; IS THAT THE SAME AS ALL OF US WHO ARE BORN AGAIN, AND SAVED?”

The Israel of God are; “born again” yes, but they do not believe they are “saved” they believe Jesus words;--“He who endures to the end will be saved.” (Matt 24; 13)

(So a person’s final salvation is not determined at the moment that he begins to put faith in Jesus.)

Also Paul urged anointed ones of his day, not to be overly confident of their salvation—“work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Phil 2; 12)

(Paul wanted them to realize that their final salvation was not yet assured.)

THE JEWS BEING THE CHOSEN PEOPLE.

They WERE yes, but not now;-- Matt. 23:37, 38: “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the killer of the prophets and stoner of those sent forth to her,—how often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks together under her wings! But you people did not want it. Look! Your house is abandoned to you.”

Spiritual Israel replaced Natural Israel;--Jer. 31:31-34: “‘Look! There are days coming,’ is the utterance of Jehovah, ‘and I will conclude with the house of  (spiritual) Israel and with the house of Judah a new covenant . . . And they will no more teach each one his companion and each one his brother, saying, “Know Jehovah!” for they will all of them know me, from the least one of them even to the greatest one of them,’ is the utterance of Jehovah.”

(That new covenant was made, not with the nation of natural Israel, but with the loyal followers of Jesus Christ to whom hope of heavenly life was being extended. When instituting the Memorial of his death, Jesus gave them a cup of wine and said: “This cup means the new covenant by virtue of my blood.” [1 Cor. 11:25])

WE ARE THE GENTILES, (CHRISTIANS).

If Natural Israel had stayed faithful & accepted Jesus, they alone would have went to heaven as rulers with Christ; but since they didn’t, those who are going to heaven are from all races & nationalities.

Fleshly distinctions are of no consideration in the Christian congregation, its members being all one in union with Christ Jesus. (Ro 10:12; Gal 3:28) Jehovah, having ‘fully reconciled both peoples [Jews and non-Jews] to himself in one body’ through Christ, could hardly be expected to make a division between the two groups now by separating fleshly Jews from Gentiles in the vision given to John. (Eph 2:11-21; Ac 15:7-9) This is particularly evident when the divine principle stated by Paul is taken into account.

Non Jews & Jews make up those serving in heaven, & Gentiles & Literal Jews make up the earthly class also.

“WHEN HE SAID THAT HE WAS GOING TO PREPARE A PLACE FOR ME, AND THAT HE WOULD RETURN FOR ME, I MUST BELIEVE THAT.”

We can learn from everything Jesus said & of course we are to love one another; however as was illustrated last night at our meetings for instance;-- Jesus said to his APOSTLES on his last night “ I am going my way to prepare a place for YOU, that where I am YOU also may be..”

Jesus was talking specifically to his apostles, he wasn’t saying; EVERYONE will go to heaven to be with Jesus. Just the same as if you heard a friend asking another friend to a meal, you wouldn’t think for a minute it included you, would you? So in that sense, what Jesus said on his last night about; “where I am you also may be” isn’t meant for you or I.

Jesus didn’t say he was going to prepare a place for you Cliff, he said he was going to prepare a place for his apostles.

HE SAID THAT I MUST BE BORN AGAIN TO SEE THE KINGDOM OF GOD

It is true that those with a heavenly hope must be “born again” but Jesus stated the qualifications you have to meet BEFORE you can be “born again” if people don’t meet the needed criteria, then no matter how sincere they are, they are not “born again”

Plus the Bible also shows that many people who do the will of God will live here on earth, as happy subjects of that Kingdom. (Matt. 6:10; Ps. 37:29)’ so there are 2 classes of people, making it vital to know which class we are a member of.

UNLESS WE ARE SAVED, WE CAN’T GET TO THE FATHER?

The bible is full of people who aren’t “saved” as you put it, yet look what it says of them;--Regarding John the baptizer, Jehovah’s angel said: “He will be filled with holy spirit right from his mother’s womb.” (Luke 1:15) And Jesus later said: “Among those born of women there has not been raised up a greater than John the Baptist; BUT a person that is a lesser one in the kingdom of the heavens is greater than he is [Why? Because John will not be in the heavens and so there was no need for him to be “born again”]. But from the days of John the Baptist until now [when Jesus stated this] the kingdom of the heavens is the goal toward which men press.”—Matt. 11:11, 12.

Another person was King David--The spirit of Jehovah was “operative” upon David and “spoke” by him (1 Sam. 16:13; 2 Sam. 23:2), but nowhere does the Bible say that he was “born again.” There was no need for him to be “born again,” because, as Acts 2:34 says: “David did not ascend to the heavens.

We do not need to be “born again” to “get to the Father” many servants of God prayed to him & were heard, ones such as Job & Abraham.

THERE ARE ONLY TWO GROUPS OF PEOPLE.THOSE OF US WHOSE NAME IS WRITTEN IN THE LAMBS BOOK OF LIFE, AND THOSE WHOSE NAME IS NOT WRITTEN, WE ARE EITHER SAVED AND BORN AGAIN, OR WE ARE NOT.  WE ARE HEAVEN BOUND, OR WE ARE NOT.

Well it appears I am wasting my valuable time again, because that is NOT what the bible teaches & it appears you are not willing to be taught. So I will leave you to your beliefs, however unscriptural.

Brenda


---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Thanks again for the quick response.  I am sorry if you feel answering my questions is a waste of your valuable time.  I do not believe that it was.  It was valuable to me.  I promise that I will never bother you again.  The only reason I ask anything, is because I want to learn.  I feel our time is very near and there is greater importance.  I spend at least 2 1/2 hours a day in the word.  That does not mean that I know much, but I am trying to learn.  I may take the bible to be more literal than you do, but that does not mean the bible is wrong.  God looks at our hearts and knows our thoughts.  He does not look out our outter self or garments.  He does not care how we dress, or what kind of a show we put on.  He sees our heart and thoughts.  I will always believe the bible to be the inspired Word of God and will believe that.  There are points that I wonder about, and many times those come from JW friends.  Almost everytime I ask them to explain and stuff they tell me that they will research it and get back to me.  Only one person one time did that.  They actually got back to me.  It was not what I had asked, and it took 7 months but God bless them trying.  At least here I had an opportunity to ask someone who is kind enough to try and answer questions and help.  But this time I wasted their valuable time, as you stated, "Well it appears I am wasting my valuable time again".  I am sorry for that.  You even failed to close with your normal "all the best".  I thank you for your time.  One of my life strives is to use the, "as you do to the least of my people, so do you to I".  I try and treat everyone as if I was treating them the way I would treat Jesus.  That's just me.  I don't expect that from anyone else, but it is a nice way to be.

I wish you much easier questions that do not waste your valuable time.  As I promised, you will not have any more from me.

God's Blessings.... cliff


Answer
Hi Cliff, I just want to say; now I fully understand why you have so many Witness friends & yet your still a born again Christian & not a Witness; you are not interested in learning the truth, you are so sure that you are born again your ears are closed, thats why the Witness took " 7 months" they will know the answer straight off, but they will also feel they are wasting their valuable time with a person whose not willing to change.

Did you seriously believe that the Witness didnt know the answer to your basic bible question??? we meet born agains day in day out, we have books written to help us answer all their misguided beliefs.We dont need 7 months to research any question a born again may throw at us, weve heard them time & time again.

I can only pray that your heart condition changes one day.

In the meantime I do wish you all the best
Brenda