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Jehovah`s Witness/A poster clalls my statement idiotic !

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Hi Derrick as you can see are the discussion the gentile times and Rev 11: 15 still on!  A poster said to Grunbaum when said that Jerusalem, has the abillity to start the biggest war and human history and he tells Grunmbaum my statement is idiotic!

Now I hope the poster read this post and tell me just how idiotic the Bible can be through the prophet Zehariah and the world as we see it today , how Jerusalem is the spectrum of news almost every day a city the Jews wont give up a city that cause great powerful mations to are odds with one another . No other city are as much disputed as Jerusalem


And in that day I will make Jerusalem , to be a burdensome to all the nations and people ... Zech 12: 3

As you can see Grunbaum is heving a hard to deny the existence of a real Jerusalem ! ,Now maybe this poster can also tell us where Mergiddo is where the final biggest war will take plae in the end.

As I read Zech prophecies extensively about the city in the last days and God,s plans with it!


Keep well !

Answer
Good evening, Johan, and thanks for writing.

Yes, I saw the statement that you mentioned.  I wouldn't worry too much about that, Johan.  The reason they call your statement "idiotic", is because they can't refute it.  This is typical of JWs...When they can't refute your message, they attack the messenger.  Yes, its really childish, but is very common among many of these people.  

What is "idiotic", is that they actually think God has reneged on His many promises to Israel as a nation, and that he has replaced Israel with "spiritual Israel".  

Like Grunbaum himself said in his reply to the questioner...

"Christendom dont believe in spiritual Israel"


Well, OF COURSE we don't.  Simple reason being, there is NO SUCH thing as "spiritual Israel" in the Scriptures.  Now, if "Brother Ed" would like to discuss this issue further and muster the courage to write someone who isn't one of his own, then he can feel free to discuss why believing the Scriptural prophecies, is so "idiotic".  

We could have fun with that one all day.  Romans 11 completely destroys their notion of "spiritual Israel", and no way can this chapter be applied to ANYONE but the NATION of Israel.

If they want to talk about idiotic statements that make their jaws drop, they should try reading their OWN statments.  They seem to think that the reason the prophecies can't be talking about NATIONAL Israel, is because they have rejected the Messiah.  I guess it escapes them, that the Jewish rejection of the Messiah was ALSO prophesied as well, even when Jehovah was making the promises to keep His hand on them, and bring them to a knowledge of Christ.  That fact proves nothing...In fact, it shows the prophecies will be proven true, because not only was the REJECTION of the Messiah prophesied, but also the RESTORATION of the nation, by their eventual acceptance of the Messiah.

Let me say this in conclusion.  Basically, this "replacement theology" nonsense as taught by groups like JWs, Church of Christ, and others, amounts to the same thing as a man promising his wife that he will get her a new diamond ring.  Well, he then goes out and buys the diamond ring for ANOTHER woman who is not his wife.  When his wife confronts him about this, and tells him that he lied to her and didn't keep his word, he replies by saying...."What?  I kept my word....I bought the ring".  

Unfortunately, he bought the ring, but not for the one whom he promised to buy it for.  

That is "replacement theology" in a nutshell....God made promises, and fulfills them not the ones He made them to, but to someone else.

It is ridiculous, unscriptural, and yes....even "idiotic" to claim that the prophecies from Jehovah Himself, will not be fulfilled exactly as He said.  It is the WT prophecies that never come to pass....God's words always come to pass.

You are correct, Johan...Grunbaum is having a hard time with that, and why wouldn't he?  He is trying to defend an unscriptural position, for which there is no Biblical defense.


Take care, and God bless.


Derrick

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Derrick Holland

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I was raised in the religion known as Jehovah`s Witnesses for 13 years. Since becoming a born-again Christian, I have researched extensively this religion, especially their doctrines and their history. I can answer questions about their doctrines from the perspective of Biblical Christianity. To be clear: Jehovahs Witnesses is the religion of my upbringing, though I myself was never baptized into the religion, nor have I ever been considered as a Jehovahs Witness.

Experience

29 years of Biblical research into the fundamental doctrines of the Christian faith, and how they differ from the teachings of the Watchtower.

Organizations
I would advise each questioner to this forum, to carefully READ the profiles of the various volunteers. There are several such as myself, who are not practicing JWs, but will provide you with an accurate and honest answer, regarding JW teaching. If we don't know the answer, we will try to research and get it for you. There are also some excellent practicing JWs here, who also endeavor to give you a factual and honest answer, based on their point of view. I believe by getting both points of view, the questioner can weigh the evidence for themselves, and make an informed decision. Unfortunately, there are also 3 here who claim to be JWs, but do NOT give honest, or well-researched answers. They will tell you only what they want you to believe, and they often hide facts about the history of their religion, as well as print untruths about other people's beliefs. This is done in an attempt to deceive the unsuspecting reader. It can be easily seen who these 3 are, simply by reading the public posts and "answers" which they write. Their posts will normally be filled with personal attacks, and if you question them about some teaching or aspect of the Watchtower that makes them uncomfortable, they will often reject your question, question your motives for asking it, tell you that you have been reading "apostate" sites, or turn the conversation into an attack on another expert. These ones are better avoided, as there is nothing to be gained by way of positive discussion, as they are not interested in intelligent conversation, or honest dialogue. If after reading the forum, you still have any questions as to who they are, just ask me, and I will be happy to tell you. And I can also provide documentation of their willful dishonesty. One thing is for certain...in a forum where people from both sides claim to be "Christians", there should never be any willful lying. Such ones only create a distraction in the forum, and provide nothing of any real value.

Education/Credentials
High School, some college. Studies of God's Word, the Bible, and how it compares to JW theology. I have found my own personal study and experiences to be far more valuable than any formal education or training. The Bible message is clear...Salvation is ONLY through and by the shed blood of Jesus Christ, and no religious organization has a thing to do with it. While attendance at a Bible-preaching, Bible-believing church is a must for spiritual growth and fellowship, no church can grant salvation to its members. Nor is joining a particular group a prerequisite for being saved.

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