Jehovah`s Witness/Being Chosen
QUESTION: Hello Bro DW,
Are you a Christian? I mean you personally? I ask because I was reading your profile where you state among other things:
7)WTBTS have scriptural proof that they have been chosen by Jesus. What about you personally?
And what verses do you mean for WTBTS? I am happy for WTBTS. But I have read the Bible many times and have never come across any verses that speak of any entity other than the individual that is chosen.
And so, I take very personally John 14:6
Jesus answered, I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
John 14:13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.
Thank you, David
Thanks for writing.
Yes I am a Christian. God has brought me to Christ and into his organization that Christ is head over.
44 No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him.....45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘They will all be taught by Jehovah.
2 "And it must occur in the final part of the days+ [that] the mountain of the house+ of Jehovah will become firmly established above the top of the mountains,+ and it will certainly be lifted up above the hills;+ and to it all the nations must stream.+ 3 And many peoples will certainly go and say: “Come,+ YOU people, and let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will instruct us about his ways, and we will walk* in his paths.”+ For out of Zion law will go forth, and the word of Jehovah out of Jerusalem"
25 "not forsaking our meeting together,+ as some have the custom, but encouraging one another,+ and all the more so as you see the day drawing near"
17 "Be obedient to those who are taking the lead among you+ and be submissive,+ for they are keeping watch over you* as those who will render an account,+ so that they may do this with joy and not with sighing, for this would be damaging to you"
5 "I left you in Crete so that you would correct the things that were defective* and make appointments of elders in city after city, as I instructed you: 6 if there is any man free from accusation, a husband of one wife, having believing children who are not accused of debauchery* or rebelliousness.+ 7 For as God’s steward, an overseer must be free from accusation, not self-willed,+ not quick-tempered,+ not a drunkard, not violent,* not greedy of dishonest gain, 8 but hospitable,+ a lover of goodness, sound in mind,*+ righteous, loyal,+ self-controlled,+ 9 holding firmly to the faithful word* as respects his art of teaching,+ so that he may be able both to encourage* by the teaching that is wholesome*+ and to reprove+ those who contradict."
1 Tim 3:
8 "Ministerial servants should likewise be serious, not double-tongued,* not indulging in a lot of wine, not greedy of dishonest gain,+ 9 holding the sacred secret of the faith with a clean conscience.
10 Also, let these be tested as to fitness* first; then let them serve as ministers, as they are free from accusation.
12 Let ministerial servants be husbands of one wife, presiding in a fine manner over their children and their own households. 13 For the men who minister in a fine manner are acquiring for themselves a fine standing and great freeness of speech in the faith that is in Christ Jesus"
1 cor 14:
40 "But let all things take place decently and by arrangement"
Now tell me what difference have these scriptures made to your original viewpoint??
---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------
QUESTION: Thank you, Bro DW. The scriptures that you cite are all words of the Apostle Paul where he set out to structure congregations of believers similar to what he was familiar with in the structure of Judaism. Jesus never mentioned such things.
But I am still curious about the scriptural proofs for WTBTS. As you quote from John 6:44, Jesus spoke of calling or choosing a person.
7)WTBTS have scriptural proof that they have been chosen by Jesus.
Here's the problem first you have to actually recognize the work Jesus left his disciples to do until he returned as executioner.
Making this comment here
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<The scriptures that you cite are all words of the Apostle Paul where he set out to structure congregations of believers similar to what he was familiar with in the structure of Judaism. Jesus never mentioned such things>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Really makes a mockery of a number of scriptures, here's a few.
2 Tim 3:
16 "All Scripture is inspired of God"
1 John 4
"Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired statement,*+ but test the inspired statements* to see whether they originate with God,+ for many false prophets have gone out into the world"
45 "It is written in the Prophets"
21 “Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing+ the will of my Father who is in the heavens will"
So you know I'd love to help you out however this is the way I see things
If I wanted to go along with your argument it would leave me these implications
At the least we are left with four gospels, Two have to be dismissed Luke and John because they wrote other books that we are dismissing as not really worth reading making them unreliable writers.
This leaves Matthew and Mark.
Matthew we've seen Jesus say that not everyone who believes in him will be saved. So that throws the credibility of Matthew into question, unless we can interpret that verse differently using the two books we have left.
So really we're left with studying Mark and Matthew to try and identify true Christianity.
Matthew's in doubt so we can come back to that later I don't have time to research an alternative meaning of the verse quoted.
So with a very brief read to start with in Mark if I wanted to find the truth I'd be looking for a religion who believed that almighty God didn't need approval from anyone
11 And a voice came out of the heavens: “You are my Son, the beloved; I have approved you.
Who's message was the kingdom of God
14 "Jesus went into Gal′i·lee,+ preaching the good news of God+ 15 and saying: “The appointed time has been fulfilled, and the Kingdom of God has drawn near"
who preached like Jesus did from place to place with his friends
38 "But he said to them: “Let us go somewhere else, into the towns nearby, so that I may preach there also, for this is why I have come"
didn't believe in "once saved always saved"
14 “The sower sows the word.+ 15 These, then, are the ones alongside the road where the word is sown; but as soon as they have heard it, Satan comes+ and takes away the word that was sown in them.+ 16 Likewise, these are the ones sown on rocky ground; as soon as they have heard the word, they accept it with joy.+ 17 Yet they have no root in themselves, but they continue for a time; then as soon as tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, they are stumbled. 18 There are still others that are sown among the thorns. These are the ones who have heard the word,+ 19 but the anxieties+ of this system of things* and the deceptive power of riches+ and the desires+ for everything else make inroads and choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful. 20 Finally, the ones that were sown on the fine soil are those who listen to the word and favorably receive it and bear fruit—30, 60, and 100 times more"
Who were very organized
7 He now summoned the Twelve and started sending them out two by two,+ and he gave them authority over the unclean spirits.+ 8 Also, he gave them orders to carry nothing for the trip except a staff—no bread, no food pouch, no money* in their belts+— 9 but to put on sandals and not to wear two garments.* 10 Further, he said to them: “Wherever you enter into a home, stay there until you leave that place.+ 11 And wherever a place will not receive you or listen to you, on going out from there, shake off the dirt that is on your feet for a witness to them.
39 "And he instructed all the people to recline in groups on the green grass.+ 40 So they reclined in groups of 100 and of 50"
I can't believe this!!!!. Just as we were doing so well too!!!!, Mark mentions Isaiah!!. Didn't we just disregard that??
6 "He said to them: “Isaiah aptly prophesied about you hypocrites, as it is written"
Wait a sec here's another verse warning against blasphemy. Wouldn't it be blasphemy to reject all but two books of the Bible??
20 Further, he said: “That which comes out of a man is what defiles him.+ 21 For from inside, out of the heart of men,+ come's...........blasphemy"
Or had we already discounted Mark as well now, because he tried to use Isaiah??
I'm sorry I thought I'd cracked it!! I'm way too confused now!!
Here's my dilemma I either use the whole bible or I ignore the whole bible.
Which do you think I should do??