Jehovah`s Witness/Capital Letter
Thank you for the last response anyway that really make sense.
Now, I just want to add something it's about capital letter issue.
It started when I told him that how can he be sure to point out a specific "HOLY SPIRIT" in person(such as the 3rd person in the TRINITY the HOLY SPIRIT), since an angels, even God and even Jesus are also "HOLY SPIRITS"??? With that he then said that if I would have to look at the very clear difference(while showing me the capitalized H and S as in Holy Spirit) then that's the time I'm going to be able to point out a specific "HOLY SPIRIT"(such as the HOLY SPIRIT or the 3rd person in the TRINITY). The same also with the title (Son of God when referring to JESUS) He said, it distinguishes JESUS from other (sons of God) Because when referring to JESUS, it uses the CAPITAL LETTER "S" denoting a DEITY so as to the HOLY SPIRIT also capital "H" and "S"
Was he right with this statement? Moreover, can you explain to me what the "UNCIALS" means ???
Thanks and L.F.
Thanks for writing back.
The easiest way to answer your question is to determine IF the holy spirit is a person.
If it's a person then the Trinity doctrine is true and correct. We should ALL accept it as true.
If it's not a person then the consequences is dire and many.
Some of which are:
1) Majority if not all members of Christendom (all who claim to follow and worship the holy spirit as God the Holy Spirit) are lied to.
2) Many if not all of Christendoms teachers / pastors believed and taught a lie.
3) Lied about God.
4) Lied about Jesus.
5) Lied about the holy spirit.
6) And are in line for destruction for believing and teaching a lie.
Serious stuff that we ALL should be aware of and sure of.
So the questions is:
Is the holy spirit a person?
All Trinitarians will say Yes.
Their evidence they claim is the Bible (most of the time KJV). They will point to:
-> Spurious texts like the ones written in 1 John 1:7.
--> and texts that presents the holy spirit as a person with attributes like:
speaking, teaching, bearing a witness, a helper,a comforter, a guide, ruling as king, the pronoun he, etc, in other words life like attributes.
-> and Capital letters such as Holy Spirit.
They will also point to:
-> statements made by the so called "Church Fathers" and so called "scholars".
that is, Athanasian Creed creators / promoters and the like.
But if you analyzed and study these "evidence" carefully with an open and unbiased mind you will come to a different conclusion like all of Jehovah's Witnesses did.
Take for instance the life-like attributes of the holy spirit. Just because the Scripture portray/present the holy spirit in personified way doesn't mean that it's a person. No it's not a person, not someone but something just like someone calling a car "her" or a boat "her" or an organization "mother" or a space ship mother ship, etc. No, these things are not persons but are made to appear like a "person" because they / it has some human-like attributes. Just like someone who bought a brand new red corvette where the owner will says "she's a beut.." because he's comparing it to qualities possessed by beautiful women.
In the same vain, since the holy spirit - Jehovah's active force - originates from God, thus IT can manifest life like attributes. Since Jehovah God is holy, holy, holy thus his spirit - his power - is holy (to the superlative degree).
To understand this better, it's like the electricity coming from a Power Plant. When the electricity leaves the power plant and travels trough the electrical power lines to your house, that electricity will ACTIVATE whatever appliance is connected to IT. If it's a radio you will hear sound. If it's meat grinder, it will make it grind, if it's power saw, it will saw, etc. In other words whatever the equipment is plugged to it, the electricity will activate / react to it accordingly or vice-versa.
In the same manner, God's holy spirit, His active force, when He sends it, IT will do what it was sent to do. If we asked for it, to help us cope with our problems, it will do what we asked for IT to do. If we asked to help us recall a scripture, IT will do what we asked for IT to do.
If Jehovah God sends it to create something, it will react to what it was sent to do, just like electricity will react to sound if the receiver is a sound machine.
Case in point:
“1 In [the] beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth proved to be formless and waste and there was darkness upon the surface of [the] watery deep; and God’s active force was moving to and fro over the surface of the waters.” (Genesis 1:1, 2)
“By the word of Jehovah the heavens themselves were made, and by the spirit of his mouth all their army.”—PS. 33:6.
““Raise YOUR eyes high up and see. Who has created these things? It is the One who is bringing forth the army of them even by number, all of whom he calls even by name. Due to the abundance of dynamic energy, he also being vigorous in power, not one [of them] is missing.” (Isaiah 40:26)
“For his invisible [qualities] are clearly seen from the world’s creation onward, because they are perceived by the things made, even his eternal power and Godship, so that they are inexcusable;” (Romans 1:20)
It is by means of God's holy spirit - His active force - that all things were created. Jesus used it to resurrect and feed people too.
If we need comfort, and asked for the holy spirit, it will comfort us by calming down our thoughts and inner feelings. Our mind and body will react to it if we truly and fully trust God.
If Jehovah God sends his holy spirit to make people speak different languages and tongues, it will do that which it was sent to do. People will get filled with it as in the case of the 120 disciples of Christ in the first century. They get anointed with it much like a oil was used to anoint a person to do a specific task.
“. . .Now while the day of the [festival of] Pentecost was in progress they were all together at the same place, 2 and suddenly there occurred from heaven a noise just like that of a rushing stiff breeze, and it filled the whole house in which they were sitting. 3 And tongues as if of fire became visible to them and were distributed about, and one sat upon each one of them, 4 and they all became filled with holy spirit and started to speak with different tongues, just as the spirit was granting them to make utterance. 5 As it was, there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, reverent men, from every nation of those under heaven. 6 So, when this sound occurred, the multitude came together and were bewildered, because each one heard them speaking in his own language. 7 Indeed, they were astonished and began to wonder and say: “See here, all these who are speaking are Gal·i·le′ans, are they not? 8 And yet how is it we are hearing, each one of us, his own language in which we were born? 9 Par′thi·ans and Medes and E′lam·ites, and the inhabitants of Mes·o·po·ta′mi·a, and Ju·de′a and Cap·pa·do′ci·a, Pon′tus and the [district of] Asia, 10 and Phryg′i·a and Pam·phyl′i·a, Egypt and the parts of Lib′y·a, which is toward Cy·re′ne, and sojourners from Rome, both Jews and proselytes, 11 Cre′tans and Arabians, we hear them speaking in our tongues about the magnificent things of God.”” (Acts 2:1-11)
“Therefore because he was exalted to the right hand of God and received the promised holy spirit from the Father, he has poured out this which YOU see and hear.” (Acts 2:33)
As for the so called "Church Fathers" - by whose authority they became "Church Fathers" - from God or men? The historical evidence points to men. As such their teachings and doctrines are not rooted in the truth but traditions and philosophies of men- just like the Trinity doctrine.
As for the capitalization of the Holy Spirit - it's a very poor and laughable defense to prove that it is a person and not something. Whoever uses this defense is poorly educated in the truth and ignorant of the facts to the highest degree.
For instance, are you aware that there was a time during the fourth, fifth century C.E. and ninth century C.E. where a large portion of the Greek Septuagint version (that is, the Vatican No. 1209, the Sinaitic, and the Alexandrine) were written in CAPITAL letters or UNCIALS? And also a time when some of the manuscripts were written in small (cursive) letters called minuscules?
And that according to history these style of handwriting were in vogue until the arrival of the PRINTING MACHINE?
And that passage of time brought in more improvements such as the use of "ligatures" and other writing styles, so and so forth?
If you do, then you're more knowledgeable than your pastor.
Questions though is which of these writing styles prove that the holy spirit is a person?
If you're a trinitarian (like your pastor) which writing style do you think he will favor - uncials or minuscules?
Obviously the uncials, isn't it?
But do agree that just because the writer used all capital letters (uncials) to write his version of the Bible, that it automatically make something into someone - a person?
What if that person used the minuscule style writing, what does this prove?
Nothing if he's trying to prove that the holy spirit is someone not something.
Isn't it Dave? That's why your pastor used the UNCIALS to prove a very shaky if not non-existing defense.
So like I said - whoever uses this as a defense to support the Trinity doctrine, in regards to the holy spirit is ignorant of the facts.
BTW - here's an UNCIAL jpg of one of the Gospel:
*** w61 4/15 p. 256 Questions From Readers ***
Questions From Readers
● Why are the pronouns “he” and “him” used in the New World Translation in reference to the holy spirit in such places as John 16:7, 8, whereas in other places the pronoun “it” is used?—B. H., U.S.A.
As a rule the New World Translation uses the masculine pronouns “he” or “him” when the Greek pronoun referring to the spirit’s office is in the masculine gender and singular in number. It uses the neuter pronoun “it” when the personal pronoun in the Greek text is in the neuter gender. Whenever variations have been made these are noted in the foot notes.
The Greek word for spirit is in itself neuter in gender and is properly referred to, therefore, by the neuter pronoun in English because it does not have personality. The footnotes in the New World Translation also call attention to this matter. However, when the holy spirit is personalized, as is the case at John 16:7, 8, where it is referred to as “the helper,” the pronouns used in Greek are in the masculine gender because in Greek “helper” is a masculine noun, but arbitrarily so in gender.
In this matter it will greatly help when we understand that in Greek and many other languages—different from English—nouns often are regarded as masculine or feminine from the standpoint of grammar although neuter as regards sex. Thus in Spanish mesa, meaning “table,” takes a feminine article, la, and libro, meaning “book,” takes the masculine article el, although obviously neither has sex or personality. In an accommodated sense this is also done in English, for it is common to refer to a certain ship by the feminine pronoun “she.” English is a very convenient language in that its nouns do not have gender arbitrarily and all its articles, “a,” “an,” and “the,” are neuter, but there is much to be said in favor of the arbitrary use of gender as regards exactness, variety and beauty.
That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah, you alone are the Most High over all the earth.—Ps. 83:18.
*** ti p. 22 The Holy Spirit—God’s Active Force ***
JESUS spoke of the holy spirit as a “helper,” and he said it would teach, guide, and speak. (John 14:16, 26; 16:13) The Greek word he used for helper (pa·ra′kle·tos) is in the masculine gender. So when Jesus referred to what the helper would do, he used masculine personal pronouns. (John 16:7, 8) On the other hand, when the neuter Greek word for spirit (pneu′ma) is used, the neuter pronoun “it” is properly employed.
Most Trinitarian translators hide this fact, as the Catholic New American Bible admits regarding John 14:17: “The Greek word for ‘Spirit’ is neuter, and while we use personal pronouns in English (‘he,’ ‘his,’ ‘him’), most Greek MSS [manuscripts] employ ‘it.’”
So when the Bible uses masculine personal pronouns in connection with pa·ra′kle·tos at John 16:7, 8, it is conforming to rules of grammar, not expressing a doctrine.
Well I hope this helps.