Jehovah`s Witness/Please help
QUESTION: Hello DW
can you please PROVIDE me the EXACT WT quote of <Good News 1976 p 14> Because my PASTOR just show me a partial QUOTE which describes of BEING a "PROPHET" here's his MESSAGE FOR ME LAST NIGHT:
Dave, let's look at how the WT describes 'inspired.' Good News 1976 p 14 "What is here meant by the word "inspired" prophet? It means that God, the Creator of heaven and earth, moved these men by his spirit or invisible empowering force, putting into their minds what they should write down as his "word" or message for mankind." So this WT July 1 1943 "He merely uses the 'servant' class to publish the interpretation after the Supreme Court by Christ Jesus reveals it." WT April 15,1943 p 127 says "This is not giving any credit to the magazine's publishers but is due to the great Author of the Bible with its truths and prophecies and who now interprets its prophecies. HE IT IS THAT MAKES POSSIBLE THE MATERIAL THAT IS PUBLISHED IN THE COLUMNS OF THIS MAGAZINE." (Caps added) Zion's WT 1894 "We see no reason for changing the figures--nor could we change them if we would. They are, we believe God's dates, not ours. But bear in mind that the end of 1914 is not the beginning, but for the end of the time of trouble." Sounds like they are inspired to me. But because they're CONFUSED, they TRIED to make you BELIEVE they're NOT! And ALso claiming to be "prophets" means inspired also. And why would God have a faithful slave running His org that weren't inspired? Think about that DAVE, they(JW) were described as "LIKE A TROUBLED SEA" at ISAIAH 57:20 .... You must beware of that..."
>>As you see that he AFFIRMED to me that JW's really are INSPIRED... And one more thing I showed him Brenton Hepburn's PREVIOUS answer regarding 1975 but he replied that Fred Franz GIVE DATES(In the FALL of SEPTEMBER) So he said it again, where's THE APOLOGY?
Looking forward DW(ASAP)
P.S. I can't follow up to Brenton because he's on VACATION
ANSWER: Hi Dave
Thanks for writing.
There's a number of points here to consider.
Firstly let me just pick out a point your pastor said
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Sounds like they are inspired to me. But because they're CONFUSED, they TRIED to make you BELIEVE they're NOT!>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Let's get this straight we're not confused it's people like him that are confused and the reason they're confused is because they're too busy listening to and reading apostate propaganda, half quotes and basically complete and utter nonsense.
It's just a totally stupid comment . How can you be confused about whether you're inspired or not?? You're either inspired or you're not there's nothing confusing about it!!!
Now before we go any further let's get this right. JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES ARE NOT AND DO NOT CLAIM TO BE INSPIRED!! I'm a Jehovah's witness and I'm telling you that I do not look at the WTBTS as inspired men. They're just not!! Nor do they say they are. IT'S A FACT!!
Here's some quotes from the WTBTS on the subject starting in 1870 by C T Russell and going all the way to the 2000's . There's one for every decade.
<<1870s: We do not object to changing our opinions on any subject, or discarding former applications of prophecy, or any other scripture, when we see a good reason for the change,—in fact, it is important that we should be willing to unlearn errors and mere traditions, as to learn truth.... It is our duty to "prove all things."—by the unerring Word,—"and hold fast to that which is good."
1880s: “We have not the gift of prophecy.”
1890s: Nor would we have our writings reverenced or regarded as infallible, or on a par with the holy Scriptures. The most we claim or have ever claimed for our teachings is that they are what we believe to be harmonious interpretations of the divine Word, in harmony with the spirit of the truth. And we still urge, as in the past, that each reader study the subjects we present in the light of the Scriptures, proving all things by the Scriptures, accepting what they see to be thus approved, and rejecting all else. It is to this end, to enable the student to trace the subject in the divinely inspired Record, that we so freely intersperse both quotations and citations of the Scriptures upon which to build.
1900s: It is not our intention to enter upon the role of prophet to any degree, but merely to give below what seems to us rather likely to be the trend of events—giving also the reasons for our expectations.
Someone may ask, Do you, then, claim infallibility and that every sentence appearing in "The Watch Tower" publications is stated with absolute correctness? Assuredly we make no such claim and have never made such a claim. What motive can our opponents have in so charging against us? Are they not seeking to set up a falsehood to give themselves excuse for making attacks and to endeavor to pervert the judgments of others?
1910s: However, we should not denounce those who in a proper spirit express their dissent in respect to the date mentioned  and what may there be expected . . . We must admit that there are possibilities of our having made a mistake in respect to the chronology, even though we do not see where any mistake has been made in calculating the seven times of the Gentiles as expiring about October 1, 1914.
1920s: Many students have made the grievous mistake of thinking that God has inspired men to interpret prophecy. The holy prophets of the Old Testament were inspired by Jehovah to write as his power moved upon them. The writers of the New Testament were clothed with certain power and authority to write as the Lord directed them. However, since the days of the apostles no man on earth has been inspired to write prophecy, nor has any man been inspired to interpret prophecy.
1930s: We are not a prophet; we merely believe that we have come to the place where the Gentile times have ended.
1940s: This pouring out of God's spirit upon the flesh of all his faithful anointed witnesses does not mean those now serving as Jehovah's Witnesses are inspired. It does not mean that the writings in this magazine The Watchtower are inspired and infallible and without mistakes. It does not mean that the president of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society is inspired and infallible, although enemies falsely charge us with believing so.... But we confess with the Scriptures that the day of such inspiration passed long before 1870, as the apostle Paul showed it would. . . . Inspired speaking and writing passed away with the last of the twelve apostles, by whom the gifts of the spirit were imparted to others. Yet God is still able to teach and lead us. While confessing no inspiration for today for anyone on earth, we do have the privilege of praying God for more of his holy spirit and for his guidance of us by the bestowal of his spirit through Jesus Christ.
1950s: The Watchtower does not claim to be inspired in its utterances, nor is it dogmatic. It invites careful and critical examination of its contents in the light of the Scriptures.
1960s: The book [Life Everlasting in Freedom of Sons of God] merely presents the chronology. You can accept it or reject it.
Our chronology, however, ... is reasonably accurate (but admittedly not infallible).
1970s: In this regard, however, it must be observed that this “faithful and discreet slave” was never inspired, never perfect. Those writings by certain members of the “slave” class that came to form the Christian part of God’s Word were inspired and infallible, but that is not true of other writings since. Things published were not perfect in the days of Charles Taze Russell, first president of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society; nor were they perfect in the days of J. F. Rutherford, the succeeding president. The increasing light on God’s Word as well as the facts of history have repeatedly required that adjustments of one kind or another be made down to the very present time.
1980s: It is not claimed that the explanations in this publication are infallible. Like Joseph of old, we say: “Do not interpretations belong to God?” (Genesis 40:8) At the same time, however, we firmly believe that the explanations set forth herein harmonize with the Bible in its entirety, showing how remarkably divine prophecy has been fulfilled in the world events of our catastrophic times.
1990s: Those who make up the one true Christian organization today do not have angelic revelations or divine inspiration. But they do have the inspired Holy Scriptures, which contain revelations of God’s thinking and will. As an organization and individually, they must accept the Bible as divine truth, study it carefully, and let it work in them.
2000s: Although the slave class is defined as “faithful and discreet,” Jesus did not say that it would be infallible. This group of faithful anointed brothers still consists of imperfect Christians. Even with the best of intentions, they can be mistaken, as such men sometimes were in the first century.>>>>
This is our position. We are not confused it's plain and simple. There's nothing hard about it whatsoever.
<<<<<<<<can you please PROVIDE me the EXACT WT quote of <Good News 1976 p 14> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I have had a look at the book you asked me to look at and all it's talking about is Bible writers being inspired . Here's the paragraphs in question.
HOW THE GOOD NEWS WAS RECORDED
8 The men who wrote down the Bible were imperfect, subject to weaknesses and error. As humans, they did not differ from other people. The apostle Paul told men who were wrongly viewing him and his missionary companion Barnabas as gods: “We also are humans having the same infirmities as you do.” (Acts 14:15) How, then, was it possible for imperfect men to produce a record that is actually God’s message?
9 It was because they did not write of their own impulse, but were inspired by God. What is here meant by the word “inspired”? It means that God, the Creator of heaven and earth, moved these men by his spirit or invisible empowering force, putting into their minds what they should write down as his “word,” or message, for mankind. For example, the psalm writer David said:
“The spirit of Jehovah [God] it was that spoke by me, and his word was upon my tongue.” (2 Samuel 23:2)
And concerning prophetic messages, the apostle Peter wrote:
“No prophecy of Scripture springs from any private interpretation. For prophecy was at no time brought by man’s will, but men spoke from God as they were borne along by holy spirit.”—2 Peter 1:20, 21.
10 It was no problem for God, the Supreme Being and Creator of all the universe, to convey messages to faithful men on earth. In modern times men have traveled to the moon, and the messages they sent back from there to earth by radio came through clearly and understandably from over 400,000 kilometers out in space. Also, TV pictures were transmitted over all that distance, so that men on earth could actually sit in their homes and watch astronauts walking about on the moon. If man can transmit messages in this way, how easy must it be for the Creator of all things to transmit messages and visions to men on earth, even from beyond “the heaven of the heavens“! (1 Kings 8:27) As God conveyed his thoughts to the minds of Bible scribes, they wrote these down as “the word of God“—his message. (Hebrews 4:12) God, by his spirit, also directed men to assemble these sixty-six “little books,” and these only, to make up the complete Bible, known as the Bible “canon.”
AN ACCURATE AND RELIABLE RECORD
11 An amazing thing about the Bible is the carefulness with which it records details, and also its complete harmony. For example, in Genesis, chapters 5 and 10, it sets out the family lists from the time of the first man Adam to that of the sons of Noah, covering a period of more than 2,000 years. Later, the priest Ezra wrote First Chronicles and devoted the first nine chapters to repeating and enlarging on these previous family lists, bringing the record down through another 1,500 years of ancient history to the time when the Israelites returned from captivity in Babylonia. Still later, both Matthew and Luke, in their Gospels, repeated essential parts of these earlier records, and extended the Bible family lists down to Jesus Christ. (Matthew 1:1-17; Luke 3:23-38) Thus, under the direction of God’s spirit, the Bible writers made a permanent record of the line of descent from our first ancestor, Adam, down through more than 4,000 years to Jesus, the “Son of man.” Of his own Gospel account, the physician Luke wrote:
“I have traced all things from the start with accuracy, to write them in logical order.” (Luke 1:3)
The record is indeed accurate and logical.
12 The Bible speaks of early ‘histories.’ (Genesis 2:4; 5:1) These may have been transmitted by word of mouth. But in this event how could accuracy have been ensured? God created the first man, Adam, perfect. Later, he rebelled against God, so that God sentenced him to die. However, it took a long time for his once-perfect body to deteriorate to the point of death. He lived for 930 years, into the time of Lamech, the father of Noah, who could thus learn early history directly from Adam. Lamech could communicate all of this to Noah, and to Noah’s son Shem, whose near-perfect physique enabled him to live on for 500 years after the Flood. Shem would be able to convey to Abraham and to his son Isaac detailed information about the pre-Flood world. Isaac could relay this on to his grandson Levi, and evidently Levi to his grandson Amram, the father of Moses. Thus, in relating early history by word of mouth, only five links would be needed between Adam and Moses—Lamech, Shem, Isaac, Levi and Amram.
13 However, due to inherited imperfection, and probably due also to changed conditions following the Flood, mankind was growing progressively weaker, Isaac living only 180 years, and Moses, 120 years. As man’s life-span dropped toward seventy or eighty years, the Creator saw fit to have mankind’s early history preserved accurately as a permanent record. Thus we would always have the reliable information concerning mankind’s beginnings. The Creator used Moses, under inspiration, to compile this record, which became the first part of the Bible.
There's absolutely nothing there about us being inspired at all. It's about the Bible writers so I really have no idea what he's on about!!
<<<<<<<<<<<"We see no reason for changing the figures--nor could we change them if we would. They are, we believe God's dates, not ours>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
OK look I highlight this quote above as an example.
The fact is ANYBODY who is a follower of the Bible believe's his way of life is from God or his teachings are from God.
If your pastor was standing up there saying to you "you're going to burn in hell" and you went up there and said to him "why did you say that?" he'd say "God say's it, these are God's teachings not mine, I'm just telling you what God say's". It doesn't mean he's claiming inspiration or claiming God's directly speaking to him, it just means he's got it from the Bible. It's exactly the same thing.
Now just imagine your pastor became a witness and he said "I don't believe in hell fire anymore" so you said to him "but you told me it was from God, you told me God said it" what would he say?? "Yeah but I was wrong, that's what I honestly believed at the time due to my study of the scriptures" would you then say "No you're a false prophet, you said it was from God this is a claim of inspiration" You could say that but it would be totally ridiculous!!
So it's exactly the same, EXACTLY just because it's a date rather than a doctrine. Makes entirely no difference.
It's all interpretation of scripture, misinterpreting scripture does not make you a false prophet!!
Dave it's really pretty simple this is what the Bible say's we need to do to find the truth.
4 "Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world"
So we test the "inspired expressions" or in other words "the scriptures" to find the truth.Who ever doesn't have the correct bible teachings is the false prophet. That's literally all you have to do, to find it. I'll put our Bible teachings up against anyone's, including your pastor. In fact get him to write to me then we'll see who's the false prophet!!
Follow up if you need
P.S I didn't read Brenton's letter if you have a specific question in mind regarding it let me know.
[an error occurred while processing this directive]---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------
QUESTION: Thank you DW
Can you also include the Page no. of each?? Thanks
Anyway, regarding my conversation with Brenton, I just made it private so I think I can't give you the LINK since it needs my E-MAIL ADD to confirmed it! I can't give you my E-MAIL here since it's PUBLIC... But if you want, I'll send it to you PRIVATELY...
Moreover, I have another question to you DW, at Matthew 24:45, the "faithful slave" was to "watch over His domestics" until He(Jesus) RETURNED!! The Watchtower has been teaching that He "returned" circa 1919, though "invisibly"; and how convenient is THAT?? I just can't Grasp the POINT for now... My brain's NOT working these days @_@ Please explain...
Thank you in advance
Thanks for writing
<<<<<<Can you also include the Page no. of each?? Thanks>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I don't really understand the question, you want the page number of each what??
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Anyway, regarding my conversation with Brenton, I just made it private so I think I can't give you the LINK since it needs my E-MAIL ADD to confirmed it! I can't give you my E-MAIL here since it's PUBLIC... But if you want, I'll send it to you PRIVATELY...>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Yeah that's fine
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Moreover, I have another question to you DW, at Matthew 24:45, the "faithful slave" was to "watch over His domestics" until He(Jesus) RETURNED!! The Watchtower has been teaching that He "returned" circa 1919, though "invisibly"; and how convenient is THAT?? I just can't Grasp the POINT for now... My brain's NOT working these days @_@ Please explain>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
We don't teach he returned in 1919 at all!!
He began ruling from heaven in 1914 and he selected his slave in 1919. Whilst still in heaven. This was at the point he selected them to feed his domestics.
He has to do it invisibly from heaven because that's where he lives in the spirit realm. He left Earth never to return
19 "A little longer and the world will behold me no more"
1 Tim 6:
16 "who dwells in unapproachable light, whom not one of men has seen or can see"
That's the entire reason he left signs so we would know he had begun his reign.
3 “Tell us, When will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?”
4 And in answer Jesus said to them: “Look out that nobody misleads YOU; 5 for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many. 6 YOU are going to hear of wars and reports of wars; see that YOU are not terrified. For these things must take place, but the end is not yet.
7 “For nation will rise against nation and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be food shortages and earthquakes in one place after another. 8 All these things are a beginning of pangs of distress.
9 “Then people will deliver YOU up to tribulation and will kill YOU, and YOU will be objects of hatred by all the nations on account of my name. 10 Then, also, many will be stumbled and will betray one another and will hate one another. 11 And many false prophets will arise and mislead many"
2 And I saw, and, look! a white horse; and the one seated upon it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went forth conquering and to complete his conquest.
3 And when he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say: “Come!” 4 And another came forth, a fiery-colored horse; and to the one seated upon it there was granted to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another; and a great sword was given him.
5 And when he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say: “Come!” And I saw, and, look! a black horse; and the one seated upon it had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 And I heard a voice as if in the midst of the four living creatures say: “A quart of wheat for a de·nar′i·us, and three quarts of barley for a de·nar′i·us; and do not harm the olive oil and the wine.”
7 And when he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say: “Come!” 8 And I saw, and, look! a pale horse; and the one seated upon it had the name Death. And Ha′des was closely following him. And authority was given them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with a long sword and with food shortage and with deadly plague and by the wild beasts of the earth"
So you're confusing yourself mate, that's why you need a Bible study to help you learn the facts.
Time's running out my friend. It really is.
Follow up if you need