I like you. You are reasonable and sincere and don't buy into the majority of the questionable things that are said or occur. You remind me a lot of my JW family.
When you made this statement, "That is far different from the sort of prophecy that Jehovah's prophets had in foretelling future events. Jehovah DIRECTLY told his prophets what to say", I thought, "Really?"
When the WTBTS has made itself abundantly clear that it is the mouthpiece of God. The quotes that fallible people are writing it does not offset the expectation that, as God's mouthpiece, even fallible people should be correct just as the prophets were in the Bible.
If the published material is not expected to be completely true, fine...admit it, just present it for what it is, someone's interpretation of scripture. Few would question that.
But that's not the way it is. Forced unity and the words of the FDS prescribe a necessary belief of fallible material. There are thousands upon thousands of sad stories of people being disfellowshipped for apostacy for simply suggesting that something in print could possibly be wrong. And then when JW's are questioned by non-JW's about why things in print are wrong, there is no denial of that fact. They just get some answer about fallible men.
Okay, those are my feelings. Again, I completely respect and appreciate the way you think and conduct yourself on this forum. You and Brenda truly demonstrate good fruit.
Thank you for your thoughts, and the complements. I am learning to accept complements. Usually they make me very embarrassed, and I never feel like I deserve complements. I try my best to follow the advise of Colossians 4:6
“Let YOUR utterance be always with graciousness, seasoned with salt, so as to know how YOU ought to give an answer to each one.”
I understand your concerns. I have seen many injustices.
I do not know if you have read all the correspondences I have had on this subject, so, I will be brief.
The Biblical word “prophet” has a very broad meaning . Basically it means to be a spokesman - to speak on behalf of another.
The prophets of the Bible spoke on behalf of Jehovah. Sometimes it was to tell of a future event (usually a calamity not not always). So Jehovah is the only real “future forecaster”.
Other duties of Jehovah's spokes persons (prophets), was to promote true worship. To remind the Israelites, being a nation dedicated to God, that they had an obligation to follow Gods laws. Often that just meant pointing the Israelites to the previously written law code.
That is the roll we understand JWs to be. Promoting pure worship.
The Bible tells us to search Gods word because there are hidden treasures in it. 1 Corinthians 2:6-10
“ 6 Now we speak wisdom among those who are mature, but not the wisdom of this system of things nor that of the rulers of this system of things, who are to come to nothing. 7 But we speak God’s wisdom in a sacred secret
, the hidden wisdom, which God foreordained before the systems of things for our glory. 8 This [wisdom] not one of the rulers of this system of things came to know, for if they had known [it] they would not have impaled the glorious Lord. 9 But just as it is written: “Eye has not seen and ear has not heard, neither have there been conceived in the heart of man the things that God has prepared for those who love him.” 10 For it is to us God has revealed them through his spirit, for the spirit searches into all things, even the deep things of God
The self proclaimed men of the Governing Body put upon themselves a heavy responsibility. (I say self proclaimed in the sense that God dose not directly say in any way who is to be on the GB. There is no set criteria for being on the GB as there is for having the responsibility of being an elder) (Luke 12:48
“Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be demanded of him; and the one whom people put in charge of much, they will demand more than usual of him.” Hebrews 13:17
) “.for they are keeping watch over YOUR souls as those who will render an account” Any elder no matter in the local congregation, of on the GB will render an account before God for what they do or say
Now when the GB find what they think is a “gem” they are not to keep it to themselves but share it all. The more knowledge we have, the more knowledge we gain. I expect them to make mistakes. We build on what we know.
When I was at school we were taught there were 9 planets orbiting our sun. As more investigation went by it was decided based on some criteria that Pluto was no longer a planet.
I was taught at school that there were 98 elements on the periodic table. Now there is 118 .
Our knowledge of the Bible is far from being full as the principle at 1 Corinthians 13:12, 13
shows “12 For at present we see in hazy outline by means of a metal mirror, but then it will be face to face. At present I know partially, but then I shall know accurately even as I am accurately known. 13 Now, however, there remain faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.”
None of the dates that the WTBTS have come up with has ever been a future foretelling prophecy. What they have been are perceived explanations of previously written prophecy. If you read through my correspondence with Dee and Robert you will see explanations of that.
“ But that's not the way it is. Forced unity and the words of the FDS prescribe a necessary belief of fallible material”
I personally disagree with that. I have never been forced to believe anything the WTBTS has ever published. I have said several times in the 9 years I have been here that there are things I disagree with or don't understand the reason for .
You go onto to say
“There are thousands upon thousands of sad stories of people being disfellowshipped for apostacy for simply suggesting that something in print could possibly be wrong.”
Yes I have read many a sad account of ones being disfellowshiped. For “seemingly” apostate reasoning’s.
However I have to disagree that it is because they “simply suggesting that something in print could possibly be wrong”. The stories That I have read and heard suggest to me that there is more involved. Usually I perceive
pride on the part of the one “suggesting” something is wrong, their way is better. Or they have tried to teach that their idea is “more”correct. Unfortunately I will admit that some over zealous elders over step the bounds of “authority” and jump to conclusions too quick of what the persons motives may be. Those elders are held responsible before Jehovah for doing so.
The act of disfellowshiping some one “should” and I emphasis “should
” be the absolute
last resort. Elders have an obligation to do all that cam to help anyone that is perceived to be going down the wrong path no matter what the problem. I have seen many injustices of that happening. I have had close friends and family members that has happened to. Those that are humble have not gotten so upset they stop wanting to serve Jehovah, but have continued attending meetings and been reinstated. Some let their pride overrule their emotions and back right away.
So a person that “just suggest
” that something is wrong and gets disfellowshiped as a result tells me that something else is up
, and, or, the elders are not fulfilling their responsibilities.
What is not encouraged is the teaching of our own ideas. I disagree on some things, but there is no way I would try to influence some one else that I was correct or the WTS was wrong. I do not know if I am correct. I just see things differently.
No one today is privileged to be inspired by God as the prophets and Bible writers were, so we must expect mistakes by imperfect humans. It is how we personally deal with the mistakes of others that can affect our relationship with God.
I have been typing all day, answering people, my mind is getting fuzzy, so I hope I have made sense. Thank you again fro writting, and for being patient with me