Jehovah`s Witness/Date?

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Question
I was reading your answer to a question and you mentioned a date the witnesses are predicting 2015 ,I began going over past questions and found the one who is predicting this is Mr Grünbaum.

I wanted to go to him and ask this question but I dont see his link. I continued to read from his site and noticed you and he has had a fire storm but strangely it stopped.Can you go in to detail on this prophecy by Mr Grünbaum and I assume he has left this board in shame from reading his last posts but reading your post during that time frame you seemed sad to see him leave which I found surprising considering the hatred between you two.

Answer
Hello, Ace.  Thank you for writing with your question and observations.

Let me address this comment first, if I may.  You wrote....

"you seemed sad to see him leave which I found surprising considering the hatred between you two"


I want to say that I do not hate Mr. Grunbaum.  Only he can answer for his feelings towards me.  What many people do not realize, is that he and I have corresponded at length through e-mail, off of this forum.  We still do every so often.  He did state one time that he hated me, but he has also stated many times that he cares about me and respects me.  Not so long ago, in fact.  

Yes, I hated to see him leave the forum, and yes, we have had many debates, and most of them turned quite heated.  Have you ever watched a football game where 2 teams are grinding it out, and even throw punches at each other during the game, when the action gets intense?  But at the end of the game, they meet and shake hands?  That's a pretty good description of how it was with Grunbaum.  There were various reasons I had for not wanting to see him go, some of which I cannot state here.  But I will say that Grunbaum was very zealous in his answers.  I did not always like his mannerisms...in fact, I rarely did.  But he was here a long time, and I hated to see that time come to an end.

Let me explain why....Grunbaum could, at least, explain some reasons for why he believed as he did.  There are several JWs who volunteered for this forum, no doubt out of sincerity and great zeal for their religion.  Unfortunately, their zeal wasn't balanced with a great deal of Bible knowledge, and they thought the way to silence the non-Witnesses, was to lie and slander (Examples:  DW, Eddie G, Rando, etc).  Grunbaum, unlike some of the less intelligent Witnesses here who seem to only be able to slander me as an "opposer" or "apostate", realized that I am an honest, fair, and decent person.  He has told me such in private e-mails.  Granted, he also has said some not-so-nice things in public about me, but that is all part of defending what he believed. But generally he was much friendlier behind the scenes.

So no, I do not have hate or animosity towards him.  Many disagreements, yes.  Hate, no.


You said...."I was reading your answer to a question and you mentioned a date the witnesses are predicting 2015 ,I began going over past questions and found the one who is predicting this is Mr Grünbaum.

I wanted to go to him and ask this question but I dont see his link. I continued to read from his site and noticed you and he has had a fire storm but strangely it stopped.Can you go in to detail on this prophecy by Mr Grünbaum"


Let me clarify that this is not merely Grunbaum's prophecy.  He is not the only one espousing this notion.  There are several JWs on board with him in this, some on this site.  To their credit, some are not on board with it.  I cannot go into a great deal of detail, because I myself am learning more and more as to why they believe that October of 2015 is going to be the time of the Tribulation.  I am privileged to be able to see and keep track of their developing reasons, but I also want to be respectful of the fact that I have been given this privilege by them.  Please forgive me for the obscurity, but I can only say that I am privy to some of the dicussions, and that is all I can say.  

What I can tell you, is that they point out that the Bible uses the number 40 numerous times, in what seems to be particular patterns.  They then take the number 40, and begin at the year 1975, and after adding 40 years to that, come up with 2015.  I believe there are several things wrong with this, including using 1975 as a starting date.  If you want more information on WHY they believe this, I would recommend asking either Expert Drake, or Sister T.  They will be able to give you reasons for this view.

Most JWs do not at this time, accept the 40 year pattern as meaning anything, including a JW member of my own family.  But there is a growing number who do.  Time will tell as to the development of this idea.

Anyway, I appreciate your taking the time to write, and I hope this answer was somewhat helpful.  Take care, and have a great day.

Derrick  

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Derrick Holland

Expertise

I was raised in the religion known as Jehovah`s Witnesses for 13 years. Since becoming a born-again Christian, I have researched extensively this religion, especially their doctrines and their history. I can answer questions about their doctrines from the perspective of Biblical Christianity. To be clear: Jehovahs Witnesses is the religion of my upbringing, though I myself was never baptized into the religion, nor have I ever been considered as a Jehovahs Witness.

Experience

29 years of Biblical research into the fundamental doctrines of the Christian faith, and how they differ from the teachings of the Watchtower.

Organizations
I would advise each questioner to this forum, to carefully READ the profiles of the various volunteers. There are several such as myself, who are not practicing JWs, but will provide you with an accurate and honest answer, regarding JW teaching. If we don't know the answer, we will try to research and get it for you. There are also some excellent practicing JWs here, who also endeavor to give you a factual and honest answer, based on their point of view. I believe by getting both points of view, the questioner can weigh the evidence for themselves, and make an informed decision. Unfortunately, there are also 3 here who claim to be JWs, but do NOT give honest, or well-researched answers. They will tell you only what they want you to believe, and they often hide facts about the history of their religion, as well as print untruths about other people's beliefs. This is done in an attempt to deceive the unsuspecting reader. It can be easily seen who these 3 are, simply by reading the public posts and "answers" which they write. Their posts will normally be filled with personal attacks, and if you question them about some teaching or aspect of the Watchtower that makes them uncomfortable, they will often reject your question, question your motives for asking it, tell you that you have been reading "apostate" sites, or turn the conversation into an attack on another expert. These ones are better avoided, as there is nothing to be gained by way of positive discussion, as they are not interested in intelligent conversation, or honest dialogue. If after reading the forum, you still have any questions as to who they are, just ask me, and I will be happy to tell you. And I can also provide documentation of their willful dishonesty. One thing is for certain...in a forum where people from both sides claim to be "Christians", there should never be any willful lying. Such ones only create a distraction in the forum, and provide nothing of any real value.

Education/Credentials
High School, some college. Studies of God's Word, the Bible, and how it compares to JW theology. I have found my own personal study and experiences to be far more valuable than any formal education or training. The Bible message is clear...Salvation is ONLY through and by the shed blood of Jesus Christ, and no religious organization has a thing to do with it. While attendance at a Bible-preaching, Bible-believing church is a must for spiritual growth and fellowship, no church can grant salvation to its members. Nor is joining a particular group a prerequisite for being saved.

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