Jehovah`s Witness/JW Baptism


I read through your and wonder if you could address the following.
1. I am not clear as there seemed to be a leap. You stated:
"Before we can even make disciples ourselves ,we have to recognize Jehovah's organization." It is not clear how you arrived at this statement. Could you please clarify as it does not seem consistent with Jesus' clear directive at Matt 28:19,20.
2. Your accounts/reasoning which centered on the eunuch seem to ignore the account of the jailor and his household in Acts 16:33.  Given the individual, his family, occupation etc and timing to baptism as well as verse at Acts 16:31 there seems to be a need for clarification. Could you please address.


ANSWER: Hi mate,thanks for writing

Here's something that you appear to be failing to grasp . Baptism texts are baptism texts they are biblical pattern for baptism. What we're trying to do here is get God's thoughts on what we need to do before baptism and not our own traditions or own opinions.

Jesus words are clear. I agree and I did address them. Just ask yourself one question what is the name of the holy spirit?? It does not have a name. Therefore we have to be baptized in "recognition" of something . Just as in the "name" of the law means in recognition of the law and all that it stands for. To just pick out one verse and use that as a text for all of whole baptism without trying to figure out what those words mean, doesn't work it makes no sense for Jesus to use the expression "in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit and then leave everyone to guess what those words mean. The Bible tells us what they mean.

Let's just take one aspect the Father. The Father was the God of the Jews, Jehovah ,the ONE true God. There is no trinity with the Jews. If you don't recognize that, that is who the Father is then you are immediately failing the requirement for baptism in Matt 28: 19 because you don't recognize the Father. I need to go no further than that then to show that every trinitarian baptism is the wrong baptism. We have just discounted every trinitarian baptism on the planet what are we left with??

There's just so many way's to go with this look at some of the things Jesus said about his Father.

John 6:45 "It is written in the Prophets: ‘They will all be taught by Jehovah"

Immediately Jesus directs us to the PROPHETS the Hebrew scriptures to teach us recognition of his Father. There's hundreds of scriptures here's just one.

4 "In the final part of the days,
The mountain of the house of Jehovah
Will become firmly established above the top of the mountains,
And it will be raised up above the hills,
And to it peoples will stream.
 2 And many nations will go and say:
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah
And to the house of the God of Jacob.
He will instruct us about his ways,
And we will walk in his paths.”
For law will go out of Zion,
And the word of Jehovah out of Jerusalem.
 3 He will render judgment among many peoples
And set matters straight respecting mighty nations far away.
They will beat their swords into plowshares
And their spears into pruning shears.
Nation will not lift up sword against nation,
Nor will they learn war anymore"

This is Jehovah's organization right here!!

This is recognition of the Father recognition of his organization. How about this

Dan 2:

44 "And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite"

Again recognition of the kingdom set up by Jesus own Father

What about the verse I used with Philip

Acts 8:

26 "However, Jehovah’s angel spoke to Philip, saying: “Get up and go to the south to the road that runs down from Jerusalem to Gaz′a"

Philip had to recognize the Angels role in making disciples in order to carry out this work

Matt 28:

19" Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations"

This is work on a worldwide scale and angels have a huge role in that work ,again this is all recognition of Jehovah's organization. If you don't know the angels role as Philip did then how are you going to recognize the angels role in your commission to find others to baptize??

2) Firstly we see this man showed recognition that Paul knew how he could be saved he showed faith in that fact

Acts 16:

30 He brought them outside and said: “Sirs, what must I do to get saved?

Acts 16:

32 Then they spoke the word of Jehovah/the lord to him together with all those in his house

They could not be baptized until they had learnt the word of God.

Then and only then, they were baptized.

So again we see recognizing and acting upon that recognition is essential for baptism.

I'm not here to try and force you to do anything. I'm happy to help you and answer your questions be assured about that. But as I showed today and yesterday the reason we baptize the way we do is because we follow the biblical pattern of baptism. Of course I want you to recognize that is how the bible shows us it should be done. Of course I want you to recognize that we take our responsibility to baptize others seriously, but it's up to you whether you choose to believe or not. I can't or have no desire to force you.

Let me leave you with one more scripture

Prov 2:

4 "if you keep seeking for it as for silver, and as for hid treasures you keep searching for it, 5 in that case you will understand the fear of Jehovah, and you will find the very knowledge of God"

The knowledge of God is like HIDDEN treasure. Will you keep digging for it as for hidden treasure or will you be like Christendom just picking up worthless scraps up off the floor, thinking that is the treasure ??

Your choice

Off the site for about a week

Take Care

---------- FOLLOW-UP ----------

QUESTION: Hello again.
Thanks for responding. You however seemed to go off on things that had nothing to do with my questions also proceeded to infer/make assumptions e.g. traditions or opinions statements. Further I fully understand about pattern and that is precisely why I asked the question.
My questions had nothing to do with the trinity. Why mention?. I am in fact not a trinitarian. Why resort to statements about "forcing"?
I simply asked about your conclusion about recognizing the organization since no logical trail to that conclusion was provided at the time.
Given instances where baptism took place without specific teaching of such (e.g. 3000 being baptised as relayed in Acts, Cornelius and the jailor as examples). I hoped you could provide a logical laid out basis for the conclusion. From what you wrote you seem to be inferring it from non baptismal texts. The Bible touches on many things, it does not mean they all need to be recognized before baptism. So pointing to scriptures on topics, or events that led to a situation does not necessarily justify that they need to be recognized by the one being baptized. Perhaps with that in mind, can you take another go at this. If not for my sake, as you seem to think I am arguing with you, then for other readers with some difficulty grasping.

Hello again

Thanks for writing

You seem to be under a misapprehension for the reason as to my comments. I mentioned traditions and trinitarian baptism not necessarily for your purpose but for others reading. In my experience many people don't realize where certain ideas come from, most of it, specifically religion is purely traditional.This is something that true worshippers should avoid. Also many people learn by process of elimination so once you've eliminated all trinitarian baptisms as false your options are narrowed down as to what is right. Many of my answers focus on process of elimination. If you are going to be writing to me you need to be aware that this is how I approach most questions. Another point is you claim no logical conclusion was reached the first time. The person who wrote to me would get the point as he has some knowledge of the use of angels in Jehovah's organization. Those who don't such as yourself usually follow up not getting the point and that's when I expand as I did in my last letter.

Moving on.

I'm struggling to see what you don't get, I thought I made it pretty simple. Unless your problem is just not clear to me. However I shall give it one more try just in case what I said really wasn't that clear .So let me try and make this really simple for you. We have two aspects here one is that we must baptize in recognition of the Father,Son and Holy spirit two is that it is our responsibility to do that.

To work out how we carry out that responsibility we use the scriptures as an example . What we know is that we Jehovah doesn't care how we carry out our responsibilities as long as they are within the boundaries Jehovah has set and as long as we take them seriously. This point is made clear in this illustration

Matt 25:

24 “Finally the slave who had received the one talent came forward and said: ‘Master, I knew you to be a demanding man, reaping where you did not sow and gathering where you did not winnow. 25 So I grew afraid and went and hid your talent in the ground. Here, you have what is yours.’ 26 In reply his master said to him: ‘Wicked and sluggish slave, you knew, did you, that I reaped where I did not sow and gathered where I did not winnow? 27 Well, then, you should have deposited my money with the bankers, and on my coming I would have received it back with interest"

The slave could have used his responsibility in any way he chose as long as he used it wisely and took his task seriously.

So in EVERY bible account about baptism we see that certain teaching took place they where taught about Jesus, they were spoken the word of God too, they where explained things and they understood etc etc etc and then and only then where they baptized.We don't know exactly what level they where at in there understanding the bible doesn't say. It's quite clear the Jews would have known Jehovah that's as much as we know their missing piece was the accounts of the Christ that Jehovah had recorded many , many times in their bible. The gentiles we can only hazard a guess what they knew but quite simply they where still taught the word of God before baptism. How many of the baptism questions that we have now they could of answered we do not know the bible does not say so it's pure speculation .The bible doesn't give us specific information except that they where taught about God and Jesus before baptism. That is a simple fact, whatever way you slice it.

So what this boils down to is this. The fact that we take our God given responsibility very seriously. As an organization we sat down and said "how can we take the responsibility that we have been given to baptize others in recognition of father son and holy spirit, seriously?" "Well lets look at bible pattern, let's recognize the fact that everyone who got baptized had knowledge of who they where dedicating themselves too and let's use that pattern to formulate questions that allows the person being baptized to recognize exactly what they are doing" So that is what happened. Hence living up to our responsibility and taking it seriously we make sure a person recognizes exactly what they are doing and it's importance and exactly who they are dedicating there life too.

So realistically all someone can argue is "I don't agree that this is how to take your responsibility seriously" I will say "I disagree" Then it goes back and forth and it get's no where.

A final point is this . Baptism is the most important thing someone will ever do in their life. If anyone believe's that you can dedicate your life to someone without knowing that person or realizing exactly what you are doing then I pity them. They wouldn't do it before marriage so why before baptism?? the biggest decision of their life. It makes no sense.On a personal note I am very grateful for the baptism questions they certainly made me want to dedicate my life to my Father and I guarantee that I'm not alone.

Take Care  

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Bro DW


I have many years of experience serving Jehovah . I have known Jehovah a long time and I have known his organization . I have been privileged to see great progress not only in my own personal relationship with my God and Father but within his organization. I am an avid reader of the bible and have been gifted by my Father with the indescribable privilege of being allowed to understand his own word.


The truth is all about scripture and logic. The two go hand in hand . There is not one bible verse that cannot be understood within the realms of human reasoning. Not one!! Why would it?? The bible is God's message to his creation . His creation who he made to understand things in a specific way. God is not stupid or unwise as to leave as a message then allow us to guess what it means or who he is. 1 Tim 2:3This is fine and acceptable in the sight of our Savior, God, 4whose will is that all sorts of people should be saved and come to an accurate knowledge of truth" Notice the expression "accurate knowledge".

The bible leaves signs of true christianity there are many. Jehovah's witnesses meet every single sign. One sign is the removal of false teachings that permeated the world soon after the apostles died. Jesus foretold this and he also foretold of the restoration of pure worship in the period known as the last days. The days we are currently living in. Jesus was a master of using illustrations he used an illustration to highlight this point Matt 13: "The Kingdom of the heavens may be likened to a man who sowed fine seed in his field. 25While men were sleeping, his enemy came and oversowed weeds in among the wheat and left. 26When the stalk sprouted and produced fruit, then the weeds also appeared. 27So the slaves of the master of the house came and said to him, ‘Master, did you not sow fine seed in your field? How, then, does it have weeds?’ 28He said to them, ‘An enemy, a man, did this.’ The slaves said to him, ‘Do you want us, then, to go out and collect them?’ 29He said, ‘No, for fear that while collecting the weeds, you uproot the wheat with them. 30Let both grow together until the harvest, and in the harvest season, I will tell the reapers: First collect the weeds and bind them in bundles to burn them up; then gather the wheat into my storehouse" Why did he speak in illustrations? Matt 13:10So the disciples came and said to him: “Why do you speak to them by the use of illustrations?” 11In reply he said: “To you it is granted to understand the sacred secrets of the Kingdom of the heavens, but to them it is not granted" The kingdom of the heavens is full of sacred secrets that Jesus reveals only to his followers. This privilege is open to all who are really willing to submit to God and his Christ in action not just in words. These are the ones God is looking for. Are you really one?? If so I encourage you to let Jehovah's witnesses show you what the Bible really teaches.

False religion is disgusting to God and to his true worshippers it is likened in the Bible to a harlot Rev 17:"I will show you the judgment upon the great harlot who sits on many waters, 2with whom the kings of the earth committed fornication, whereas those who inhabit the earth were made drunk with the wine of her fornication" Whereas the bride of Christ is likened to a virgin Rev 14: 4"These are the ones who did not defile themselves with women; in fact, they are virgins" These are both used as spiritual terms here and show the importance of pure and clean worship for God's people.

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