Jehovah`s Witness/A response from first question
Somewhere in life you’ve lost your way, I’m sure when you were first baptized you had a zeal for preaching and teaching. I think you need to take a step back and reexamine yourself. You had a chance to bring someone back to the organization but you only cared about being defensive. I came to you because I heard there were so many changes since I left and I wondered what had changed. But now after reading what you wrote, I KNOW I made the right choice by leaving. I think this was God’s way of making me 100% sure and I thank Him for this. Jesus commanded us to LOVE (Matthew 22:39–40) He said that this was the greatest commandment of all (Matthew 22:36-40) He preached with love and compassion (Matthew 9:36). Everything you should be out of LOVE. Your message to me was without love and compassion, it was in fact down right insulting. I am insulted for my ten year old self that cried so hard when I was baptized that I had to go into the bathroom stall to gather myself together. No one understood my tears and I didn’t either at that age. I actually am brought to tears at this very moment thinking of that day. Of course I went through the questions, no one can be baptized as a Jehovah’s Witness without doing this so I am puzzled to why you asked me. My question is about the age, what a ten year old know about the rest of his life? I have a ten and seventeen year old so I know what I am talking about. I didn’t want to come across bashing this religion or any religion out of respect for the people that follow it that is why I did not put out many details. THAT IS LOVE. But you asked me to clarify and that ten year old girl inside of me feels the need to do just that. Although you know very well what I meant.
In your message you said that “Unlike false religion, we do not baptize babies”. Five year olds are babies, I’m sorry. You spoke of a seven year old that begged to be baptized, a child’s brain is not fully developed. They are in no way able to make a decision that will impact them for the rest of their lives. This is a scientifically proven fact that I’m sure no one would dispute. My question to you is: Is the practice of five, seven and ten year olds being baptized still going on within the organization? A child strongly believes what they have been taught like I did, it’s not until we are older that be start to become our own individuals and “making the truth your own”.
My second question was about the practice of grown men (elders) asking underage girls about their sexual sins. Again, I didn’t go into details because I was trying to be respectful. You quoted scriptures that spoke about praying over someone that was sick, removing sinners from the congregation, and confessing your sins. The practice that went on when I was a JW was elders alone in the room talking to underage girls about sins. Asking them to go into graphic details, asking them “how did he touch you” “did he caress you” “did you have oral sex” and this was to girls who were still virgins (not all but some). This was an emotionally damaging situation for girls who spent their entire life sheltered, who didn’t even know what sex was although they were kissing someone. I have always felt strongly that this was something that needed to stop. This is not biblical, you cannot show me not one scripture that tells us to do this. It is manmade and I was hoping the “light got brighter” for the organization. I do not think that most of the elders even thought twice about this, but the girls did. We all talked about this. It felt like you were violated. The detailed confessions are not needed or it should be handled by women when dealing with girls.
I'll be waiting for your loving response and I will be praying for your heart! I'm sure your love and compassion can return!
Hello again Tammy,
I'm sorry if you took my response as defensive. Unfortunately, again I must say, if you did not want to get baptized and was not ready then I do not understand why you did, especially since the consensus has always been the same, "believing" and "wanting to" and "making the truth your own" BEFORE you ever get to the point of baptism. I did show you a scripture, it said go to the elders, confess...what does confess mean?
And I disagree, a 10 year old can make the truth their own, even a 5 year old IF they are so inclined. As I mentioned, every child has a different rate of growth, understanding, etc. A 5 year old is NOT a baby. 5 year old's are in school and know how to read, do math, understand right from wrong, and so much more. A baby cannot do those things. I see 4 year old's cursing people out talking like a sailor.
Their minds may not be fully developed yet, but they can still make decisions and if they feel that way then don't do it, it's that simple. Do not do it. Just because someone's parents are JW's doesn't mean the children are or will be. Again, if you were honest then you would have spared yourself the pain that you are experiencing through out your life because of being dishonest. You also said that you believed what you were taught at that age, and then you say you cried the whole time, so if you believed what you were taught at that age, your baptism should have been a happy occasion for you at that age, again, I'm seeing dishonesty on your part. It always pays to be honest.
If you were interested in coming back, why not go to the Kingdom Hall, the deciding factor shouldn't be about young people getting baptized and counsel being given to young ones who err. Having a personal relationship with Jehovah God should be your main focus Tammy. We serve Jehovah as God, not an organization. Plus you just said you do not have the same beliefs, why consider coming back if you do not have our beliefs? That doesn't add up to me.
The Bible has many examples of young ones who stayed with Jehovah, for example Samuel. He served at the temple right after he was weaned by his mother, which was around 5 years old, lived away from his parents and he served Jehovah his whole life and never strayed away. So the Bible does not agree with you Tammy.
Again, if a child who chose to get baptized
decides that they would rather live according to Satan's ways and commit sexual immorality then they have to go before a committee, if they still want to be a JW, otherwise they can leave, no one forces anyone to be a JW. If they are bold enough to do it, then why are they scared to say what they did? Double standards do not exist with Jehovah.
The congregation must remain clean, and Jehovah's name from reproach. Jehovah forbids sexual immorality and being underage does not excuse a person from wrong doing. You want to make it into something perverse because they have to say what they did so that an informed decision can be made. That's not the case, it's not just one man in a room with a little girl trying to get his jollies from her confession. It's at least 3 Elders, a committee, usually at the Kingdom Hall with their parents right in the next room or in the room, the Elders, who all serve Jehovah, are trying to get to the bottom of serious wrong doing that has no place in the congregation let alone, doing such things in the first place being underage. That's what is perverse, thinking it's all right for underage kids to engage in sexual immorality. If you are too young to make a decision to serve God then you are too young to make a decision about engaging in underage sexual activities.
So I'm getting that to you it's OK that they broke their vow to Jehovah, engaged in sexual activities being underage, just as long as they don't have to come clean about what they did, so they won't cry.
But once they get caught or whatever, then all of a sudden they are crying and scared. That's why young people are like they are today. And obviously those types of decisions are made all the time. That's why we see 10, 11, and 12 year old's having babies. There are lots of people who do not condone underage sex, the laws of the land is but one.
Also so many underage kids are committing crimes these days that they have started to charge many as adults because of the nature of the crime. And once they are caught and have to tell what they did and how they killed someone then they want to cry and feel sorry for themselves and their parents cry and say, they are babies...they are babies. Well they weren't crying like babies when they were in the act of the wrong doing though were they?
The Scriptures I gave you were to help you to see that if someone is committing sins they need to go to the elders and confess, so that they can be forgiven. Jehovah does not change, people do. His righteous ways are the same today as they have always been.
Even when a child is molested they HAVE to tell what happened to them. Only difference is one is not the child's fault and one is a deliberate act.
Here is an account when young children who were underage did wrong, and Jehovah did not excuse their wrongdoing. Jehovah does not change!
2 Kings 2:23-24 "He went up from there to Bethʹel. As he was going along the way, some young boys came out from the city and began to jeer at him, and they kept saying to him: “Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!” 24 Finally he turned around and looked at them and cursed them in the name of Jehovah. Then two she-bears came out of the forest and tore 42 of the children to pieces."
Now, was Jehovah wrong for doing that in your eyes? They were young boys, and yet their jeering got them killed, it's not a matter to take lightly Tammy, wrong doing whatever the age is serious and will not be tolerated by Jehovah. If those sexually immoral little girls lived during Bible times, they may not have been alive to complain about having to talk about it.
Women are not elders in the JW religion, nor according to the Bible Tammy.
It seems most of what you do not agree with is the direction given from the Bible, because that's what JW's follow is the Bible.
To Summarize, does young underage people still get baptized? YES
Does underage children who get baptized and then break their vow to Jehovah by deciding to engage in sexual immorality have to go before a committee still and confess what they did? YES