About Janko Expertise I am a qualified minister of Jehovah`s Witnesses and fully capable of answering any or all questions on our faith as well as others too, and the correct understanding of the Bible,which is God`s Word.
Experience My experience with our faith is quite substantial and was introduced to it in the 1960's as a child.
Question -
I work with a Jehovah Witness. My question is about the cross.
JW's claim that Jesus was crucified on a torture stake. Medical and scientific information tells us that a person crucified in this manner would die from asphyxiation in a matter of minutes, while the bible leads us to believe that Jesus hung on the cross for around 3 hours...if he hung there for 3 hours and a person hung with hands overhead dies in a matter of minutes how can you even think he was crucified in this manner?
The works of Justus Lipius were shown in the NWT bible showing one of 16 different wood cuts...the WT claims this is the torture stake that Jesus died on, but looking back into Justus' work it shows 15 other woodcuts (most of them crosses), and one of the crosses even says "the cross our Lord was hung on was like this". How can you site a book as your information claiming it proves your point and then not use the correct depiction?
When Thomas doubts Jesus he wants to see where the nails were in his hands, etc...if Jesus was crucified in the manner the WT leads us to believe then why would Thomas say nails in the plural? I have already heard one JW tell me that Thomas was sloppy in his speech when he said this and he really meant one nail...the only problem with this theory is Thomas is the one speaking...he is not the one who wrote that particular book of the NT. Why would the writer not correct this if in fact there was only one nail?
The bible also tells us quite clearly that Jesus did carry some part of his torture device to the place of his execution...from what I have seen of the different means of crucifixion only the crosses warranted carrying to the place of execution...the crossbeam was carried to the place of the execution, they were nailed to it and then it was put onto the upright stake. If the bible clearly states that he carried something that he was eventually nailed to, and we know that the torture stakes were normally fixed in the ground, how can you possible prove that Jesus was crucified on a torture stake?
I know that JW's think we as Christians should not wear crosses and whatnot because they believe it as some kind of false idol. Would this mean that 1st century Christians were guilty of idol worship since the cross quickly became a symbol of Christianity?
If the cross had not meaning then why did the Romans often depict an ass crucified on a cross to mock Christians?
These are just some of many, many issues...
Answer -
Hello Shaun,
Thank you for your question(s)Here is our explanation on your question from extensive research by the Watchtower:
Cross
Definition: The device on which Jesus Christ was executed is referred to by most of Christendom as a cross. The expression is drawn from the Latin crux.
Why do Watch Tower publications show Jesus on a stake with hands over his head instead of on the traditional cross?
The Greek word rendered “cross” in many modern Bible versions (“torture stake” in NW) is stau·ros´. In classical Greek, this word meant merely an upright stake, or pale. Later it also came to be used for an execution stake having a crosspiece. The Imperial Bible-Dictionary acknowledges this, saying: “The Greek word for cross, [stau·ros´], properly signified a stake, an upright pole, or piece of paling, on which anything might be hung, or which might be used in impaling [fencing in] a piece of ground. . . . Even amongst the Romans the crux (from which our cross is derived) appears to have been originally an upright pole.”—Edited by P. Fairbairn (London, 1874), Vol. I, p. 376.
Was that the case in connection with the execution of God’s Son? It is noteworthy that the Bible also uses the word xy´lon to identify the device used. A Greek-English Lexicon, by Liddell and Scott, defines this as meaning: “Wood cut and ready for use, firewood, timber, etc. . . . piece of wood, log, beam, post . . . cudgel, club . . . stake on which criminals were impaled . . . of live wood, tree.” It also says “in NT, of the cross,” and cites Acts 5:30 and 10:39 as examples. (Oxford, 1968, pp. 1191, 1192) However, in those verses KJ, RS, JB, and Dy translate xy´lon as “tree.” (Compare this rendering with Galatians 3:13; Deuteronomy 21:22, 23.)
The book The Non-Christian Cross, by J. D. Parsons (London, 1896), says: “There is not a single sentence in any of the numerous writings forming the New Testament, which, in the original Greek, bears even indirect evidence to the effect that the stauros used in the case of Jesus was other than an ordinary stauros; much less to the effect that it consisted, not of one piece of timber, but of two pieces nailed together in the form of a cross. . . . It is not a little misleading upon the part of our teachers to translate the word stauros as ‘cross’ when rendering the Greek documents of the Church into our native tongue, and to support that action by putting ‘cross’ in our lexicons as the meaning of stauros without carefully explaining that that was at any rate not the primary meaning of the word in the days of the Apostles, did not become its primary signification till long afterwards, and became so then, if at all, only because, despite the absence of corroborative evidence, it was for some reason or other assumed that the particular stauros upon which Jesus was executed had that particular shape.”—Pp. 23, 24; see also The Companion Bible (London, 1885), Appendix No. 162.
Thus the weight of the evidence indicates that Jesus died on an upright stake and not on the traditional cross.
What were the historical origins of Christendom’s cross?
“Various objects, dating from periods long anterior to the Christian era, have been found, marked with crosses of different designs, in almost every part of the old world. India, Syria, Persia and Egypt have all yielded numberless examples . . . The use of the cross as a religious symbol in pre-Christian times and among non-Christian peoples may probably be regarded as almost universal, and in very many cases it was connected with some form of nature worship.”—Encyclopćdia Britannica (1946), Vol. 6, p. 753.
“The shape of the [two-beamed cross] had its origin in ancient Chaldea, and was used as the symbol of the god Tammuz (being in the shape of the mystic Tau, the initial of his name) in that country and in adjacent lands, including Egypt. By the middle of the 3rd cent. A.D. the churches had either departed from, or had travestied, certain doctrines of the Christian faith. In order to increase the prestige of the apostate ecclesiastical system pagans were received into the churches apart from regeneration by faith, and were permitted largely to retain their pagan signs and symbols. Hence the Tau or T, in its most frequent form, with the cross-piece lowered, was adopted to stand for the cross of Christ.”—An Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words (London, 1962), W. E. Vine, p. 256.
“It is strange, yet unquestionably a fact, that in ages long before the birth of Christ, and since then in lands untouched by the teaching of the Church, the Cross has been used as a sacred symbol. . . . The Greek Bacchus, the Tyrian Tammuz, the Chaldean Bel, and the Norse Odin, were all symbolised to their votaries by a cruciform device.”—The Cross in Ritual, Architecture, and Art (London, 1900), G. S. Tyack, p. 1.
“The cross in the form of the ‘Crux Ansata’ . . . was carried in the hands of the Egyptian priests and Pontiff kings as the symbol of their authority as priests of the Sun god and was called ‘the Sign of Life.’”—The Worship of the Dead (London, 1904), Colonel J. Garnier, p. 226.
“Various figures of crosses are found everywhere on Egyptian monuments and tombs, and are considered by many authorities as symbolical either of the phallus [a representation of the male sex organ] or of coition. . . . In Egyptian tombs the crux ansata [cross with a circle or handle on top] is found side by side with the phallus.”—A Short History of Sex-Worship (London, 1940), H. Cutner, pp. 16, 17; see also The Non-Christian Cross, p. 183.
“These crosses were used as symbols of the Babylonian sun-god, [See book], and are first seen on a coin of Julius Cćsar, 100-44 B.C., and then on a coin struck by Cćsar’s heir (Augustus), 20 B.C. On the coins of Constantine the most frequent symbol is [See book]; but the same symbol is used without the surrounding circle, and with the four equal arms vertical and horizontal; and this was the symbol specially venerated as the ‘Solar Wheel’. It should be stated that Constantine was a sun-god worshipper, and would not enter the ‘Church’ till some quarter of a century after the legend of his having seen such a cross in the heavens.”—The Companion Bible, Appendix No. 162; see also The Non-Christian Cross, pp. 133-141.
Is veneration of the cross a Scriptural practice?
1 Cor. 10:14: “My beloved ones, flee from idolatry.” (An idol is an image or symbol that is an object of intense devotion, veneration, or worship.)
Ex. 20:4, 5, JB: “You shall not make yourself a carved image or any likeness of anything in heaven or on earth beneath or in the waters under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them.” (Notice that God commanded that his people not even make an image before which people would bow down.)
Of interest is this comment in the New Catholic Encyclopedia: “The representation of Christ’s redemptive death on Golgotha does not occur in the symbolic art of the first Christian centuries. The early Christians, influenced by the Old Testament prohibition of graven images, were reluctant to depict even the instrument of the Lord’s Passion.”—(1967), Vol. IV, p. 486.
Concerning first-century Christians, History of the Christian Church says: “There was no use of the crucifix and no material representation of the cross.”—(New York, 1897), J. F. Hurst, Vol. I, p. 366.
Does it really make any difference if a person cherishes a cross, as long as he does not worship it?
How would you feel if one of your dearest friends was executed on the basis of false charges? Would you make a replica of the instrument of execution? Would you cherish it, or would you rather shun it?
In ancient Israel, unfaithful Jews wept over the death of the false god Tammuz. Jehovah spoke of what they were doing as being a ‘detestable thing.’ (Ezek. 8:13, 14) According to history, Tammuz was a Babylonian god, and the cross was used as his symbol. From its beginning in the days of Nimrod, Babylon was against Jehovah and an enemy of true worship. (Gen. 10:8-10; Jer. 50:29) So by cherishing the cross, a person is honoring a symbol of worship that is opposed to the true God.
As stated at Ezekiel 8:17, apostate Jews also ‘thrust out the shoot to Jehovah’s nose.’ He viewed this as “detestable” and ‘offensive.’ Why? This “shoot,” some commentators explain, was a representation of the male sex organ, used in phallic worship. How, then, must Jehovah view the use of the cross, which, as we have seen, was anciently used as a symbol in phallic worship? Janko
“The Greek word rendered “cross” in many modern Bible versions (“torture stake” in NW) is stau·ros´.”
It is interesting because most Greek and Hebrew scholars both agree that the word ‘stauroo’ (the simple version) means upright stake, and the term ‘stauros’ often refers to a much more complex structure than just a simple “upright stake”. If TRUE scholars agree that the term could mean, and often did mean, a more complex structure, then why should we assume it was a simple stake in the ground? There is insufficient proof by going on the word ‘stauros’, because that word has more than one meaning.
“Even amongst the Romans the crux (from which our cross is derived) appears to have been originally an upright pole.”—Edited by P. Fairbairn (London, 1874), Vol. I, p. 376.”
This response is interesting because you typed here that OUR cross-derived from the Romans, but it is my understanding the official Watchtower beliefs are that OUR cross came from pagans long before the Romans used it.
It clearly says right there “appears to have been an upright pole”. I don’t see that it says it IS and upright pole, nor do I see that it says they were using only an upright pole at the time of Christ’s death.
“It is noteworthy that the Bible also uses the word xy´lon to identify the device used.”
“.” It also says “in NT, of the cross,” and cites Acts 5:30 and 10:39 as examples. (Oxford, 1968, pp. 1191, 1192) However, in those verses KJ, RS, JB, and Dy translate xy´lon as “tree.” (Compare this rendering with Galatians 3:13; Deuteronomy 21:22, 23.)”
Acts 5:30
30The God of our fathers raised Jesus from the dead—whom you had killed by hanging him on a tree.
Acts 10:39
39"We are witnesses of everything he did in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They killed him by hanging him on a tree,
Galatians 3:13
13Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."
Deuteronomy 21:22-23
22 If a man guilty of a capital offense is put to death and his body is hung on a tree, 23 you must not leave his body on the tree overnight. Be sure to bury him that same day, because anyone who is hung on a tree is under God's curse. You must not desecrate the land the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance.
I am not sure what bible you are using, but MY bible (NIV that is confirmed by TRUE Hebrew and Greek scholars as a good translation) translates all four passages as the word “tree”. I am also not sure of the pertinence that this has to do and how this proves that Jesus died on an upright stake? This really doesn’t prove anything. Can I see someone calling a piece of wood “tree”? Yes.
“The book The Non-Christian Cross, by J. D. Parsons (London, 1896), says: “There is not a single sentence in any of the numerous writings forming the New Testament, which, in the original Greek, bears even indirect evidence to the effect that the stauros used in the case of Jesus was other than an ordinary stauros; much less to the effect that it consisted, not of one piece of timber, but of two pieces nailed together in the form of a cross. . . .”
Once again we get back to the word ‘stauros’. Once again the simple form of this word is ‘stauroo’, which “straight up” meant an upright stake. The word ‘stauros’ often meant a more complex structure.
““Various objects, dating from periods long anterior to the Christian era, have been found, marked with crosses of different designs, in almost every part of the old world. India, Syria, Persia and Egypt have all yielded numberless examples . . . The use of the cross as a religious symbol in pre-Christian times and among non-Christian peoples may probably be regarded as almost universal, and in very many cases it was connected with some form of nature worship.”—Encyclopćdia Britannica (1946), Vol. 6, p. 753.”
It is noteworthy that you would go and put down a quote from a 1946 Encyclopedia that’s no longer around. Why not use the definition from the current Encyclopedia Britannica? Even if I wished to research this I couldn’t because you are quoting an ever-changing source of information that is long outdated…
Here’s a short exert from the Encyclopedia Britannica on the word cross:
“the principal symbol of the Christian religion, recalling the Crucifixion of Jesus Christ and the redeeming benefits of his Passion and death. The cross is thus a sign both of Christ himself and of the faith of Christians. In ceremonial usage, making a sign of the cross may be, according to the context, an act of profession of faith, a prayer, a dedication, or a…”
I know the Watchtower claims the cross is a pagan symbol so I figured I would give you the history according to Wikipedia (probably one of the best online encyclopedias):
“It is not known when the first cross image was made; after circles, crosses are one of the first symbols drawn by children of all cultures. There are many cross-shaped incisions in European cult caves, dating back to the earliest stages of human cultural development in the stoneage. Like other symbols from this period, their use continued in the Celtic cultures in Europe. For example, celtic coins minted many centuries before the Christian era may have an entire side showing this type of cross, sometimes with the five cardinal points marked by concave depressions in the same style as in stoneage carvings. Other coins may be showing the cross held by a rider on a horse and springing forth a fern leaf, sometimes identified as a Tree of Life symbol. These early sun crosses or celtic crosses have nothing to do with later Christian ones.”
Note “THEY HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH CHRISTIAN ONES”!
After this you kind of go into a tangent on how the cross has been using in the past by all these other beliefs as a pagan symbol…what does it matter who uses a cross as a symbol? It is a sign…an insignia of faith in Jesus Christ. Just because at one time the cross might have been used as a symbol of pagan worship does not mean that it can’t become a symbol of Christianity. The cross is VERY WIDELY seen as a sign of Christianity by believers and non-believers alike.
Note: If we were to make the assumption that since pagans used the cross before Christians, so that in essence makes the cross bad…what would that say for Charles Taze Russell, the founder of the Watchtower, who often used Masonic symbols?…even going as far as having Masonic symbols on the cover of Watchtower material! He also used pyramids and other symbols that had roots in pagan culture as well in his material. Would this mean that he was a pagan?
You say that the cross is a sign of worship…it is not. It’s a symbol of faith…faith in God and reverence to Christ almighty who came to earth and died for all of our sins.
Exodus 20:4-5
4 "You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me,
If you go back and read the chapter in its entirety it’s talking about other god’s and making idols in which to worship them. It never says one thing about “Thou shalt not show your faith through a symbol”. I think all Christians would agree that this passage is true in the fact that worshipping other god’s is bad. Do you think God would be displeased that I wore an outward symbol to show the entire world that I know he is God? Do you think God would strike me down for showing my faith to the world?
“Does it really make any difference if a person cherishes a cross, as long as he does not worship it?”
I don’t think it’s right to cherish or worship a cross, but using it in a symbolic sense to show your faith to the outward world is not worshipping it. If this was the case would God strike me down or rebuke me for wearing a football jersey that depicted my favorite mascot? Could this be considered idol worship? The answer is no! Wearing a football jersey is symbolically showing your love for your favorite team, and the cross would be the same for Christianity.
Overall your answer is what I expected and the same thing I got from my Jehovah Witness co-worker. The information sited does not prove the cross, nor does it prove the stake. You also danced around the works of Justus Lipius who’s depictions are shown in the NWT bible, but do not show the CROSS from his work that says “this is the kind of CROSS that our Lord was crucified on”. Why would you not answer that question? The NWT bible uses his work and credits him for doing so, and then years later removes the information from their bible leading back to Justus Lipius because it shows something different than what the Watchtower would like us to believe. The Watchtower has taken careful measure to reveal enough “truth”, while covering up enough truth to make them seem right. In my honest opinion if you are going to show something as truth, you should use the entire truth and not just the part that agrees with what you would have people to believe.
The quote from Encyclopedia Britannica was from a 1946 edition. I have looked around and cannot find an edition of the book that old. I have found a new edition that says the COMPLETE OPPOSITE of what you claim the 1946 edition says though. Please, if you are going to answer someone with insightful information, use a book that is in current publication, and not one that has not been in circulation for about 50 years…
Basically, you didn’t answer anything about the cross…you did the same as my co-worker…your response dances around the facts and uses old information to back itself, some of the information can’t even be confirmed.
I would also like to hear your response to medical FACT that a person hung in the manner depicted by the Watchtower would die in a matter of minutes…you danced around this fact as well. This has been proven more than once medically and scientifically. We know from reading the bible that Christ was on the cross for around 3 hours…modern medicine and science gives us new insight into this and tells us that it was IMPOSSIBLE for someone to be crucified in the manner depicted by the Watchtower and survive for 3 hours. If he was crucified in that manner he would have died in a matter of minutes…the bible would not account 3 hours, there would have been no conversations with the criminals to each side, and there would have been no need to pierce his side to kill him because he would have been dead long before this would have been necessary.
Answer Well you can dance your way to someone else to get the answers your looking for,but as far as myself and the other seven million of us who worship the only true God,Jehovah,
you got your answer,so live with it or not,your choice,but it does not have anything to do with how and where you will gain salvation,because John 17:3 says that you can only get everlasting life from accurate knowledge from Jehovah and Jesus Christ and not by wearing a cross around your neck
which depicts Jesus being put to death.Would you wear a image of a loved one that was the most important person in your life to show everyone how much you respected him or her?No more ignorant questions such as these directed at God's organization because it is blasphemous to do so,and also an unforgiveable sin,a sin against the Holy Spirit that
directs all the operations throughout the organization.
