Latin/grammar

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Question
Dear Maria,
Could you please help me with the following (all from de Amicitia):

1. “rursum autem recte factis commodisque amicorum necesse erit angi, dolere, invidere.” (59)
Was dative “factis commondisque” used because the verbs ”angi”, “dolere” and “invidere” require dative? What if not all the verbs require dative? Do we have to write two separate sentences? Also, “recte” is an adv., but is it used here as an adj.?

2. “cum emendati mores amicorum sint, tum sit inter eos omnium rerum consiliorum voluntatum sine ulla exceptione communitas” (61)
I have two questions: (a) It seems that “cum … tum” does not mean here “both … and …”, as it usually does. Instead it seems to mean “when, … then …” (b) Is it still correct if I add ”-que” to “voluntatum”?

3. “nec mediocre telum ad res gerendas existimare oportet benevolentiam civium” (61)
I understand the grammar but not the meaning of this sentence.

4. “Sed - saepe enim redeo ad Scipionem, cuius omnis sermo erat de amicitia - querebatur quod omnibus in rebus homines diligentiores essent; capras et oves quot quisque haberet dicere posse” (62)
(a) Is “cuius sermo (his conversation) erat (was) omnis (everything) de amicitia (about friendship)” the correct order for translation?
(b)Does “quod” just mean “that”? I saw the translation for “omnibus in rebus” is “in all other things”. I thought it means “in everything” or “in all things”.
(c)Does “querebatur” require “accu + infinitive”?
(d)In the last sentence “capras et oves …”, is “posse” part of the “accu + infinitive” structure because “querebatur” is understood? I couldn’t identify the accu. subj.

Thank you.
Robert

Answer
Dear Robert,

1.In “rursum autem recte factis commodisque amicorum necesse erit angi dolere invidere.” (Cicero, De amicitia, 59) the present infinitives “angi” and “dolere”, as verbs of feeling, take the Ablative of  Cause, while “invidere” requires the dative.
Anyway, since  “factis commodisque” can be either ablative or dative, it’s possible to use it as an ablative depending on “angi” and “dolere” as well as a dative depending on “invidere”, so that “recte factis commodisque amicorum necesse erit angi dolere invidere” means:
”it will be necessary (necesse erit)to feel grief (angi), to feel pain (dolere), to feel envy (invidere) at the good deeds (recte factis) and favorable conditions (commodisque)”.

As for the adverb  “recte”, note that “recte factis” literally means:” the rightly/well done things”, i.e.  "the good deeds”.


2. In “cum emendati mores amicorum sint, tum sit inter eos omnium rerum consiliorum voluntatum sine ulla exceptione communitas” (61) “cum … tum” , as co-ordinating conjunctions,  mean exactly “when, … then …”

As for “omnium rerum consiliorum voluntatum ....communitas”, the three genitive cases are used without commas and conjunctions.
Anyway it would be still correct if  you add ”-que” to “voluntatum”.


3. “nec mediocre telum ad res gerendas existimare oportet benevolentiam civium” (61) literally means:” nor (nec) it is proper (oportet) to consider (existimare) the benevolence (benevolentiam) of the countrymen (civium) as a poor (mediocre) weapon (telum) in/for  managing  (ad gerendas.Gerundive) civil affairs (res)”, i.e. :
“it is not right to consider the favour of countrymen as a poor weapon in civil affairs management”.

In short, Laelius says that there are limits to the indulgence that we can have to our friends since we have to consider our reputation because  the favour of our countrymen is not a poor weapon in civil affairs management.



4. Note that in “Sed - saepe enim redeo ad Scipionem, cuius omnis sermo erat de amicitia - querebatur quod omnibus in rebus homines diligentiores essent; capras et oves quot quisque haberet dicere posse” (62):
(a) “cuius omnis sermo (whose all /fundamental conversation) erat (was) de amicitia (about friendship)” is  the correct order for translation.

(b) the causal conjunction “quod” depending on “querebatur”  means “because”, and “omnibus in rebus”  means exactly  “in all  things”.
 
(c) the deponent imperfect “querebatur” requires the causal clause “ quod + subjunctive”.

(d)In the last sentence “capras et oves …..” the present infinitive “posse” is part of the “accu + infinitive” structure because a verb of saying such as “dicebat” (he said that) is understood.
As for  the accusative subject of the infinitive clause, it is  “homines” which is implied.

To sum up, “Sed - saepe enim redeo ad Scipionem, cuius omnis sermo erat de amicitia - querebatur quod omnibus in rebus homines diligentiores essent; capras et oves quot quisque haberet dicere posse” translates as :
”But –I often return to Scipio, whose discourse on friendship was fundamental to me - he complained that men were more attentive in all things [than in friendship]:[he said ] that they in fact were able to tell how many goats and sheep everybody  had.....”.

Best regards,

Maria

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