AboutTerry Andreasen (Andy) Expertise Safe and Vault related Questions;
Antique Safe Repair and Restoration;
With over 37 years in the Safe & Vault industry, if I can't answer your question I know where to get the answer.
Current Project: Restoration of three, 36 ton steel vault doors and drop floors, in the old Federal Reserve Building, San Francisco.
Experience 37 years in the Safe & Vault Industry. Service Manager for one of the largest Safe & Vault companies on the West Coast. Graduate of Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing, Safe lock Manipulation and Safe Deposit Lock Courses. Graduate of Locksmith Institute.
Certified Instructor for the California Locksmith Association teaching Basic and Advanced Lock Servicing, Basic Safe opening and Repairing.
Factory Trained by AMSEC, LORD Safes, LeFebure, Mosler, KabaMas, LaGard and Sargent & Greenleaf
Organizations SafeCrackers International
Education/Credentials Graduate of Locksmith Institute 1972
Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing 1974
Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Manipulation 1975
Graduate Lockmasters Safe Deposit Lock Servicing 1985
Instructor Certified - California Locksmith Association - 1985
Awards and Honors Retired US Army, with many decorations and awards from Vietnam, Desert Storm and Op Iraqi Freedom.
Past/Present Clients Secret Service, FBI, Dept. of Homeland Defense, US Army, US Coast Guard, US Navy, US Marine Corps, Lawerence Livermore National Lab, Bank of America, Wells Fargo Bank, various local banks, credit unions, state agencies, Jewelers, and many commercial and residential customers.
Service Area is Northern California (Fresno to Oregon and Western Nevada)
I've got a relatively old-looking Herring-Hall-Marvin safe that I can't get to open. The only possible serial number I can see is on the handle: "25618."
It's possible I may have the combination, but I've had no luck with it and am not sure about a few things.
The DIAL itself says "Herring-Hall-Marvin Co." on it, so I know it's not a Yale/S&G/etc lock. I haven't been able to find any information about HHM safes that also have HHM locks/dials.
The numbers go up to 130. There is no 0, and there is only a 12 oclock index.
I know from experience when I was younger that the safe would open while the dial was sitting on the number 15. That is, the handle would turn freely and the door could be opened.
I found a hidden slip of paper when I came into possession of the house/safe with the numbers as follows, in this order: "40 35 128 15"
The 15 struck me, as well as the 128 because I do know that the door would open when on 15, and 128 would be a possible number considering how high the dial goes. I can't imagine what else the numbers could be. But, I've had no luck trying to get it open.
Do those numbers look right to you?
I don't know if it's a 4-digit combination, or actually a 3, and the bolt opens at 15 after it is slowly turned to stop. That would make sense because I'm certain that the door was able to be opened when it was left on 15 and not relocked.
Do you think it's possible that these numbers would help me? If so could you please try to better explain the dialing procedure for a HHM lock?
I've been trying to get into this thing for months now; I know it contains old family photos and my original birth certificate among other things. I'm in no real position to afford to bring out a safe technician, so any information you could give me would be most appreciated. Thank you!
Jay
Answer Jay,
Many of the dials that HHM used, while being S&G, Yale, etc were imprinted with the HHM logo. The majority of the HHM locks that I've seen with the 130 number dial were what we refer to as "X type" or straight tail piece locks. This lock would probably have been left over from the old "HALL's Safe Co" prior to the merger in 1892. There is no lever inside of the lock. A bar (fence) attached to the bolt work would drive into the lock, after it had been dialed correctly. The lock should have 3 wheels and a drive wheel. The dialing sequence could be either of the following:
4 times left to the first number (40)
3 times right to the second number (35)
2 times left to the third number (128)
1 time right to the fourth number (15), stop. Turn the handle to open.
or
4 times right to the first number (40)
3 times left to the second number (35)
2 times right to the third number (128)
1 time left to the fourth number (15), stop. Turn the handle to open.
The easy way to tell if it is this lock is to place a little turning pressure on the handle while attempting to turn the dial. The driver will have several (up to 9) false gates that the fence will attempt to enter, binding up the dial. If this doesn't happen you may have a different lock.
When dialing, do not spin or whirl the dial. Turn slowly and smoothly and be as accurate as possible with your numbers.
