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Locksmithing/Eurovault (social) and TL rating


Can the Eurovault EFT line be considered equivalent to TL-15 or TL-30 even though UL has not rated them.

The Eurovault or social line of fire and burglary safes are attractive.

The importer states that they are equivalent to TL-15 rating as does my local dealer. Your recent posting (June 12) compares the Euro vault to Amsec 1814 9which is TL-15/30 rated)


I went back to reread the original posting.   I'm not sure if you simply misread it, but at no where in the answer did I indicate that the Eurovault was a TL-15, or equivilant.

The original questioner posed the question concerning how the four safes stacked up against each other.   I pointed out that two of them were basically the same safe (though one was relabeled).   Neither of the other two were rated, nor did I indicate that were "equivilant" to the "TL-15" rating.

While they do have their own good and bad points - YOU have to compare the safes based on their actual construction and the positive attributes which provide you with the protection that YOU require.

The TL-15 rating is NOT an indicator of how good or bad a safe is built, it is simply a standard that the safe has been tested to.   Safes which have not been tested generally do so, because they can't meet the testing standards.    While in the real world they may or may not provide adequate protection in the event of a REAL burglary, without having a safe that has at least passed some type of testing standard is about like playing the lottery - while the state says that EVERY ticket is a potential winner, in reality you know better.   The question is whether or not YOU want to take the risk.

Question:   WHAT is the purpose of a salesman?   Any salesman?   To separate you from your money!   To sell you something that you may or may not need!   To sell you something that provides THEM with the largest profit margin!  etc. etc. etc.   It doesn't matter whether it is a used car salesman or a safe salesman.   In order to make an EDUCATED buying decision, it is up to YOU to become educated in how safes are built and what DOES make one better than another.    Once YOU understand how safes are built, material used, types of locks available, weights, etc. etc. etc. THEN you can get the information about two particular safes and make an informed decision before you start handing over your cash.

Now back to the TL-15 rating.   Unless you are buying a safe to meet storage requirements for insurance purposes, or some other similar reason, the lable is simply an indicator of the safes potential.   Unfortunately, moron's in the banking and insurance industry seem to think that having a "UL" lable is a guarantee of how a safe is made.   When you compare TL-15 rated safes built 40 years ago to current models, you will find out that the newer models are severely lacking.   Unfortunately, the rising cost of steel has made all manufacturers cut back on the amount of steel actually used in safes today, which translates into - YOU the buyer, needs to really be vigilant in understanding WHAT you are buying and how it stacks up.

If a salesman indicates that a non-rated safe is equivilant to a rated safe, have them prove to you "HOW" the safe is equivilant.   If they say that they both have 3" thick walls - that doesn't mean anything.    If one has thick steel, concrete and rebar, and the other has sheet steel and sheet rock - the 3" doesn't matter because the MATERIALS are NO WHERE CLOSE to being equivilant.    Weight is also a good indicator - if two similar sized safes have a huge weight variation, it would indicate one may have more solid material than the other.    

Remember the days when they used to tell you to kick the tires when checking out a car?   well the same can be said for safes.   Knock on the top, and sides - if you get a hollow noise, it may not have that much "stuff" in the walls, if it feels extremely solid, that should be an indicator.

Bottom line - KNOWLEDGE is power!   YOU have to gain the education concerning the potential safes that YOU are considering.   If you can't trust the salesman to give you the info, then you may be at the wrong safe company.

Do I consider the standard Eurovaults equivilant to AMSEC CE or CF series TL 15/30 safes, not even close.


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Terry V. Andreasen (Andy)


Safe and Vault related Questions; Antique Safe Repair and Restoration; With over 42 years in the Safe & Vault industry, if I can't answer your question I know where to get the answer. Current Project: Restoration of an Ely Norris Cannonball Safe from the early 1900's. Will answer Safe & Vault related questions concerning age, value, restoration, moving, opening & repairing, parts, operation and history. Note: It is not my intention to teach you to open safes or to provide information which may aid in the unlawful opening of a safe. I will not give out drill points or information which I deem inappropriate.


44 years in the Safe & Vault Industry. Owner and Service Manager for one of the largest Safe & Vault companies on the West Coast. Graduate of Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing, Safe lock Manipulation and Safe Deposit Lock Courses. Graduate of Locksmith Institute. Certified Instructor for the California Locksmith Association teaching Basic and Advanced Lock Servicing, Basic Safe opening and Repairing. Factory Trained by AMSEC, LORD Safes, LeFebure, Mosler, KabaMas, LaGard and Sargent & Greenleaf Author of "The Coffee Table Guide to Antique Safes".

SafeCrackers International and the National Antique Safe Association Safe & Vault Technicians Association (SAVTA)

The Coffee Table Guide to Antique Safes

Graduate of Locksmith Institute 1972 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Servicing 1974 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Lock Manipulation 1975 Graduate Lockmasters Safe Deposit Lock Servicing 1985 Instructor Certified - California Locksmith Association - 1985 Factory trained by AMSEC, MAJOR, STAR, Johnson-Pacific, Kaba-MAS, Allied-Gary, ISM, Lord, Brown Safe, EXL, Mosler, Diebold.

Awards and Honors
2009 - 2015 - Listed in AllExperts Top 50 Experts. All Expert Categories - Safes & Security Containers, Locksmithing, Antique Safes. Retired US Army Chief Warrant Officer (CW4), with 39 years of total service. With numerous awards from Vietnam, Desert Storm and Operation Iraqi Freedom. US Navy - 1971-1981 US Army Reserve 1984-2013 US Army Retired

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US Secret Service, FBI, BATF, Local Law enforcment agencies, Diebold, Hamilton Pacific, Red Hawk Int., Chubb International, Bank of America, Wells Fargo Bank, Mechanics Bank, El Dorado Savings Bank, many Credit unions and smaller banks. McDonalds, Togos, BurgerKing, TacoBell, Carls Jr. FoodMaxx, SaveMart, Lucky's, Albertson's, Raley's, Safeway, NobHill, Bell Markets, PW Markets. Great America, Century Theatres, Cinemark Theatres, UA Cinemas, and many homeowners and small businesses. Provide warranty service for lock and safe manufactures. Service Area is Northern California (Fresno to Oregon and Western Nevada)

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