Traditional Catholics/New translation of the Mass


I hope you don't mind me asking another question, but I am really struggling at present.

Has the new English translation helped with the validity of the Vatican II Mass?  Can such a Mass ever be valid?

I have not seen the new text, so I cannot comment on it in detail.  It is reported that "for many" has been restored.  Even if that is so, the "mystery of faith" likely remains displaced, and now a vast majority of their "presiders" are not even validly ordained as priests.  Furthermore they are not instructed to see the words as anything more than a "narration," like telling a familiar old story, and not the confection of a sacrament.
Still, if one had a valid priest, and if he had the initiative to supply from his own reading and study what the Novus ordo school would never have taught him, and if he truly meant in using the new words (whatever they are) with the old meanings, it is just possible that it could attain sacramental validity.  Some years ago I did a study on whether "for all" could ever be valid, and if so under what circumstances:
The fact remains however that even if sacramental validity is attained on some few specific instances of their new-fangled ceremony, it is no more a lawful service for Catholics to attend than would be equally rare valid Anglican service, or a Mass of the East Orthodox, etc.  The bare fact of what is being done, an irreverent and mocking mutilation of the Catholic Mass, renders it intrinsically out of communion with the Church:
"   Picture if you will, a priest, Fr. Etienne Guibourg, back in the year 1666 (ironic?), who was regular and in good standing with his diocesan bishop, but privately willing to be bought.  For a generous stipend, paid by Madam La Voisin, he says a funeral Mass for a person who is not dead.  It was reverently done.  He even wore the appropriate black vestments as befits a funerary or Requiem Mass, hence the expression "black Mass," of which this was the first such offered for explicitly sacrilegious purposes.  The whole thing was a grave blasphemy since it was a "prayer," if you will, for the repose (in death) of a soul of one who was still very much alive, in order that he would just please die.
   Could such a Mass have fulfilled any lawful obligation of any poor innocent soul in attendance merely seeking his Mass for the day?  Obviously not, and this is so despite the fact that it was reverently done, that it was sacramentally valid, or even that the priest was an "approved" priest of Holy Mother Church.  The very act itself was by its nature "not in union" with the Church, and as such no heaven-seeking Catholic would have had a right to attend it."
The "new mass" was designed to bring about the death of the real Catholic Mass by outright replacing it, and almost succeeded.

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Griff Ruby


I focus on the "why" and "how" questions of the Faith and one`s need for the Church to overcome sin, live the life God wishes us, and to become what God wants us to be. My areas of expertise are particularly in the areas of practical morality, theology, Scripture, history, and personal problems and dilemmas that people face. It is important to bring a sense of proportion to the recent and current ecclesiastical situation that makes necessary having to add the clarification "traditional" to "Catholic," for a "traditional Catholic" today is simply what anyone would have called a "Catholic" only 60 years ago, and so on clear back to the beginning. I seek to provide insight and information such that you are then able to see for yourself the answer to your questions. Homework problems and trivia questions may be refused, and I am not interested in using Allexperts as a debating forum.


Years of extensive research, thought, and prayerful meditation on many of the issues that trouble Catholics today, taught catechetical classes to teenagers and adults, answered many questions already as Allexperts volunteer in Catholics category.

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I have an Engineering degree from University of California, Santa Barbara, however this obviously has extremely little bearing on my expertise here other than to document the level of my education in general.

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